When you read through the postings on this board regarding cycle training, what becomes immediately clear, is that there isn't actually a recognised National Standards Training in the UK.
To illustrate my point -
Our Local Authority, West Sussex County Council hasn't trained its instructors to National Standards Levels. Instead it has them out there plying their good old fashioned Cycle Proff. with a couple of gentle nods in the direction of the National Standards Syllabus.
Then on top of that, they've appointed the local fire service to deliver training also. Again not trained to deliver National Standards. (Ironically, since writing my original post questioning the fire service delivering cycle training, their own fire station burnt down. Highlighting if anything the need for them to get their own house in order before taking on additional duties. Imagine the fire station hadn't even got a smoke alarm fitted....
But I digress, back to my original point-
Other posts on this board support my argument that certain London trainers are again offering cycle proff. as opposed to National Standards.
So my question is this-
If there is such a thing as National Standards, then why is it not a requirement for every Local Authority, and everyone tasked with delivering Cycle Training to deliver one uniformed standard?
Can someone from the CTC, please explain why this is?
Surely a National Standards Cycle Training Scheme should be just that.
Paul Power
www.cycleschool.co.uk
www.dutchbikeshop.co.uk
www.paulpower.co.uk
National Standards Cycle Training, really?
WHat the the cycletraining.co.uk website says about the Natioanl Standard is :-
"This is due to be phased in to replace cycling proficiency and other types of (often off-road) training over the next few years creating a new generation of confident on-road bike riders throughout the country."
Note the phrase "over the next few years".
I don't know why they mention it replacing off road training . With the prevalence of MTBs then surely off training is a good idea. After all it's technically more difficult than on road riding.
"This is due to be phased in to replace cycling proficiency and other types of (often off-road) training over the next few years creating a new generation of confident on-road bike riders throughout the country."
Note the phrase "over the next few years".
I don't know why they mention it replacing off road training . With the prevalence of MTBs then surely off training is a good idea. After all it's technically more difficult than on road riding.
By stating "off-road training" I suspect they mean training on playgrounds and other areas isolated from road traffic.
Such training in isolation has been a feature of Cycling Proficiency and other such legacy training schemes.
One of the major points about the National Standard / Bikeability scheme is training-on-the-road for riding-on-the-road.
i.e. This is unrelated to any MTB training, just a confusion of terms . . . resolved by the context.
Such training in isolation has been a feature of Cycling Proficiency and other such legacy training schemes.
One of the major points about the National Standard / Bikeability scheme is training-on-the-road for riding-on-the-road.
i.e. This is unrelated to any MTB training, just a confusion of terms . . . resolved by the context.
Re: National Standards Cycle Training, really?
Paul Power wrote:When you read through the postings on this board regarding cycle training, what becomes immediately clear, is that there isn't actually a recognised National Standards Training in the UK.
But there is a recognised standard. It's called the National Standard. It's just that some people, your local authority included, haven't reached it yet.
The compulsion for everyone to reach it wouldn't work. People would just find an excuse not to implement it. What might work is providing funding to support training that does reach the standard and no funding for training that doesn't. And that's the basis of what's happening now. It's a slow process but it's happening.
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Paul Power
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- Joined: 2 Feb 2007, 12:52pm
Thanks very much for your reply.
I found your use of underlining specific words very helpful when reading your comments.
So your point is that we have a National Standard already, only it seems that some, actually lots of Local Authorities responsible for delivering cycle training aren't actually working to, or interested in working to the National Standard?
You recommend imposing funding restrictions to ensure compliance.
And have you any idea what this policy results in?
Our Local Authority insisting that parents now pay for their children to undergo cycle training.
Which means parents aren't going to pay, which means no cycle training of any sort, National or otherwise.
That means fewer young people being allowed by their parents to ride to and from school.
And so on,
Meanwhile Millions of government money has been supposedly rolled out to improve cycle training, however it doesn't seem to have rolled quite as far as West Sussex yet.
So much for a National Standard.
Similar in a way to the health service. A post code lottery system.
Live in one area of the country and you get potentially life-saving drugs for your cancer, while others it's tea and sympathy...
Paul
I found your use of underlining specific words very helpful when reading your comments.
So your point is that we have a National Standard already, only it seems that some, actually lots of Local Authorities responsible for delivering cycle training aren't actually working to, or interested in working to the National Standard?
You recommend imposing funding restrictions to ensure compliance.
And have you any idea what this policy results in?
Our Local Authority insisting that parents now pay for their children to undergo cycle training.
Which means parents aren't going to pay, which means no cycle training of any sort, National or otherwise.
That means fewer young people being allowed by their parents to ride to and from school.
And so on,
Meanwhile Millions of government money has been supposedly rolled out to improve cycle training, however it doesn't seem to have rolled quite as far as West Sussex yet.
So much for a National Standard.
Similar in a way to the health service. A post code lottery system.
Live in one area of the country and you get potentially life-saving drugs for your cancer, while others it's tea and sympathy...
Paul
Paul Power wrote:....Meanwhile Millions of government money has been supposedly rolled out to improve cycle training, however it doesn't seem to have rolled quite as far as West Sussex yet.
So much for a National Standard.
Similar in a way to the health service. A post code lottery system.
....
Paul
As far as I can see, there is funding available for the Bikeability scheme, this is basically a branded version of the National Standards. the funding covers levels 1 & 2 which are, roughly, equivalent to the Cycling Proficiency scheme. If this isn't available in West Sussex, then your local council needs to investigate being registered with Bikeability. Wiltshire council have become registered and are rolling out funded training courses throughout the country.
Perhaps the fault isn't at a national level, it is at your local council's doorstep.
Nigel
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Paul Power
- Posts: 217
- Joined: 2 Feb 2007, 12:52pm
adinigel wrote:Paul Power wrote:....Meanwhile Millions of government money has been supposedly rolled out to improve cycle training, however it doesn't seem to have rolled quite as far as West Sussex yet.
So much for a National Standard.
Similar in a way to the health service. A post code lottery system.
....
Paul
As far as I can see, there is funding available for the Bikeability scheme, this is basically a branded version of the National Standards. the funding covers levels 1 & 2 which are, roughly, equivalent to the Cycling Proficiency scheme. If this isn't available in West Sussex, then your local council needs to investigate being registered with Bikeability. Wiltshire council have become registered and are rolling out funded training courses throughout the country.
Perhaps the fault isn't at a national level, it is at your local council's doorstep.
Nigel
I think you've misinterpreted my post. I am/have laying the blame firmly at our local authority's door.
However, my point is, is if you call something National Standards, then surely every local authority should be forced to adopt the Standard. Otherwise, it's not National.
I read in another post you're a driving instructor. So would would you feel if those living in the West Sussex area, Kent area etc (all those areas who refuse to entertain National Standards), were subjected to a different driving test that the students in your area?
Wouldn't be National Stanard, would it?
As for the funding available, supposedly millions has been made available by the government for NS training. However, I have continually asked where these millions have gone, and have yet to get a satisfactory answer.
Where public funding has been made available for cycling, it should be available for everyone, and not based on the prejudices of each local authority.
A National Standard, should be just that. Or it shouldn't exist it at all.
Paul
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keepontriking
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- Location: Hampshire
- Contact:
Paul Power wrote:
I think you've misinterpreted my post. I am/have laying the blame firmly at our local authority's door.
As for the funding available, supposedly millions has been made available by the government for NS training. However, I have continually asked where these millions have gone, and have yet to get a satisfactory answer.
Where public funding has been made available for cycling, it should be available for everyone, and not based on the prejudices of each local authority.
Paul
See today's news.
http://www.cyclingengland.co.uk/pressoffice.php
I would have liked CTC to have ensured all instructors knew about this rather than coming across it by accident...but that's another story.
I wonder how many LAs will apply on behalf of independent instructors and how many will just put their fingers in their ears.
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Paul Power
- Posts: 217
- Joined: 2 Feb 2007, 12:52pm
Sadly, West Sussex County Council won't just be putting their fingers in their ears, they'll be giving two fingers up to the scheme, which is what they have being doing since it was introduced.
Again goes back to my original post - free money, ie tax payers money shouldn't be allocated on a grant scheme basis for things like cycle training.
Instead, the National Standard should have been introduced as just that - a National Standard and every Local Authority expected to deliver this training.
I despair at the way cycle training is handled here in the UK.
We, as indepdent instructors get required to jump through every hoop to get accreddited, further accreddited, re-accreddited and so on, yet the Lcoal Authority, ie the legal body responsible for delivering training doesn't have to do anything.
I've given up now on National Standards training.
I refuse to promote it anymore.
The whole thing is a fiasco.
Laughable, in fact.
A true testimnony to this country's ability to f** everything up.
If someone wants to come to our school and be trained, then they'll recieve the best possible training, delivered by cyclists. Not office-pen/pc pushers who seem to be the real winners of this grant money.
I wonder how many new desk jobs National Standards has created?
How many £28-45k salaries are now being give out?
What a farce.
West Sussex County Council and Kent County Council, good old Tory strongholds see cyclists as nothing more than an a hinderance to the passage of their polished-to-death, over-priced cars.
The fact that school children are killed cycling on the roads here means nothing to these car-obsessed councils.
Their view is very much that the children shouldn't be on the roads. Far beter for them to be safety tucked up in the back of mum and da's 4X4 for the school run.
Anyway, as you've probably gathered, I've had my fill of National Standards training.
We won't be delivering it, or supporting it in the future.
Our cycle training will be, as it has in the past 2 years given by cyclists for cyclists.
Or those who care about the welfare and safety of their children.
Because clearly West Sussex County Council, Kent Council et al, clearly don't.
Paul
Again goes back to my original post - free money, ie tax payers money shouldn't be allocated on a grant scheme basis for things like cycle training.
Instead, the National Standard should have been introduced as just that - a National Standard and every Local Authority expected to deliver this training.
I despair at the way cycle training is handled here in the UK.
We, as indepdent instructors get required to jump through every hoop to get accreddited, further accreddited, re-accreddited and so on, yet the Lcoal Authority, ie the legal body responsible for delivering training doesn't have to do anything.
I've given up now on National Standards training.
I refuse to promote it anymore.
The whole thing is a fiasco.
Laughable, in fact.
A true testimnony to this country's ability to f** everything up.
If someone wants to come to our school and be trained, then they'll recieve the best possible training, delivered by cyclists. Not office-pen/pc pushers who seem to be the real winners of this grant money.
I wonder how many new desk jobs National Standards has created?
How many £28-45k salaries are now being give out?
What a farce.
West Sussex County Council and Kent County Council, good old Tory strongholds see cyclists as nothing more than an a hinderance to the passage of their polished-to-death, over-priced cars.
The fact that school children are killed cycling on the roads here means nothing to these car-obsessed councils.
Their view is very much that the children shouldn't be on the roads. Far beter for them to be safety tucked up in the back of mum and da's 4X4 for the school run.
Anyway, as you've probably gathered, I've had my fill of National Standards training.
We won't be delivering it, or supporting it in the future.
Our cycle training will be, as it has in the past 2 years given by cyclists for cyclists.
Or those who care about the welfare and safety of their children.
Because clearly West Sussex County Council, Kent Council et al, clearly don't.
Paul