Share the space drop your pace
Share the space drop your pace
Everyone walking or cycling along the Basingstoke canal towpath was handed one of these leaflets this morning (my wife was cycling there, and she said everyone got one)
http://www.basingstoke-canal.org.uk/bcs ... ign_A5.pdf
It's slightly confusing, frankly, as the slogan, which is a registered trademark owned by the Canal & River Trust, https://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00002630923
https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/walking- ... -your-pace
basically directs non-cyclists to ignore the leaflet (who else but cyclists would 'drop your pace')
http://www.basingstoke-canal.org.uk/bcs ... ign_A5.pdf
It's slightly confusing, frankly, as the slogan, which is a registered trademark owned by the Canal & River Trust, https://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00002630923
https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/walking- ... -your-pace
basically directs non-cyclists to ignore the leaflet (who else but cyclists would 'drop your pace')
Re: Share the space drop your pace
And runners need to give way to themselves...
The theory is fine, but why a cycle symbol at 'don't block the path'?
The theory is fine, but why a cycle symbol at 'don't block the path'?
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
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Re: Share the space drop your pace
Obvious typo is obvious
Re: Share the space drop your pace
It seems very "directed" at cyclists.
Do they have any data or proof that cyclists are causing such a significant problem ?
And "blocking the path" specifically targeted at bikes ? I would have thought those double baby buggy things tended to be more of a blockage than a bike. I wonder if there is somebody there who does not like cyclists ? A teeny bit of discrimination me thinks. I'd probably be pursuing it if it was something local to me.
Ian
Do they have any data or proof that cyclists are causing such a significant problem ?
And "blocking the path" specifically targeted at bikes ? I would have thought those double baby buggy things tended to be more of a blockage than a bike. I wonder if there is somebody there who does not like cyclists ? A teeny bit of discrimination me thinks. I'd probably be pursuing it if it was something local to me.
Ian
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Re: Share the space drop your pace
Psamathe wrote:It seems very "directed" at cyclists.
Do they have any data or proof that cyclists are causing such a significant problem ?
And "blocking the path" specifically targeted at bikes ? I would have thought those double baby buggy things tended to be more of a blockage than a bike. I wonder if there is somebody there who does not like cyclists ? A teeny bit of discrimination me thinks. I'd probably be pursuing it if it was something local to me.
Ian
A local cyclist group thinks so.
http://www.wokingcycle.org.uk/baskingstoke-canal/
Re: Share the space drop your pace
dunno about that canal, but blocking the path near me is usually by fishing poles, drunks / crack heads, and students. Not sure how you can tell cyclists both that they are going too fast and blocking the path at the same time
On the other hand, I agree that it behove's cyclists to show respect for other users - they are the faster moving vehicle - but the leaflet could be worded a little differently such that it doesn't make cyclists feel that they are benig quite so castigated when I'm sure the vast majority behave in a very responsible way.
On the other hand, I agree that it behove's cyclists to show respect for other users - they are the faster moving vehicle - but the leaflet could be worded a little differently such that it doesn't make cyclists feel that they are benig quite so castigated when I'm sure the vast majority behave in a very responsible way.
Re: Share the space drop your pace
The infrastructure is a victim of its success. In other words - people are using it!
Pedestrians, motorists - all hate cyclists.
There is very little useful cycle infrastructure around, but vast amounts suitable for cars and pedestrians.
This particular path is an alternative to a busy main road. I saw a post on Facebook from someone who had been knocked off (hit and run) while cycling in the very narrow cycle lane on said road. Top comment was 'He was probably in the way'.
Also the towpath itself is by no means all sweetness and light. The drunks do hang out there, a friend of mine used to live a nice mile walk along it. She is a rather striking lady and she got some unwanted attention from the drunks/perverts, and the police advised her not to use it any more.
It's strange that they don't say 'keep your dog on a lead' too. Last time I used the path there was a man with a large dog, under control, and another coming the other way with a smaller dog, a long way in front of him. The man with the large dog had to place himself between the two animals to stop his dog savaging the smaller dog.
I don't think anyone really bats an eyelid at the daily 'incidents' on roads, but if you get one or two incidents involving a cyclist and a pedestrian, it's like the world is coming to an end.
That said, I have seen some dodgy cycling, I think the instruction to dismount at bridges is silly - some of them are wider than the normal path - but there are some narrow ones, and you get things like people cycling under a narrow blind bridge at 10mph, when someone is coming the other way - really you have to drop to walking pace and ring your bell, at least there.
Pedestrians, motorists - all hate cyclists.
There is very little useful cycle infrastructure around, but vast amounts suitable for cars and pedestrians.
This particular path is an alternative to a busy main road. I saw a post on Facebook from someone who had been knocked off (hit and run) while cycling in the very narrow cycle lane on said road. Top comment was 'He was probably in the way'.
Also the towpath itself is by no means all sweetness and light. The drunks do hang out there, a friend of mine used to live a nice mile walk along it. She is a rather striking lady and she got some unwanted attention from the drunks/perverts, and the police advised her not to use it any more.
It's strange that they don't say 'keep your dog on a lead' too. Last time I used the path there was a man with a large dog, under control, and another coming the other way with a smaller dog, a long way in front of him. The man with the large dog had to place himself between the two animals to stop his dog savaging the smaller dog.
I don't think anyone really bats an eyelid at the daily 'incidents' on roads, but if you get one or two incidents involving a cyclist and a pedestrian, it's like the world is coming to an end.
That said, I have seen some dodgy cycling, I think the instruction to dismount at bridges is silly - some of them are wider than the normal path - but there are some narrow ones, and you get things like people cycling under a narrow blind bridge at 10mph, when someone is coming the other way - really you have to drop to walking pace and ring your bell, at least there.
Re: Share the space drop your pace
That's the important point. There's very very little dedicated cycling infrastructure.
On the road motorists see it as theirs and cyclists are in the way.
On the path pedestrians see cyclists as a nuisance.
On the road motorists see it as theirs and cyclists are in the way.
On the path pedestrians see cyclists as a nuisance.
Re: Share the space drop your pace
I'm never quite sure how to 'give way' to pedestrians - if they are going your way you tinkle your bell cheerfully and say hello, and they move over so you can overtake saying 'thanks!' If they are going the opposite way they see you and stand or walk to one side so you can cycle past. I've sometimes stopped to let pedestrians walk past but have been beckoned to cycle on as they stand to one side. That's if it all goes well! I do stop and let people walk past if I'm on a path where I'm not sure I'm supposed to be cycling though!
“My two favourite things in life are libraries and bicycles. They both move people forward without wasting anything. The perfect day: riding a bike to the library.”
― Peter Golkin
― Peter Golkin
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Re: Share the space drop your pace
Hi
Just read the posts about motorist-cyclist and pedestrian-cyclist conflict. I've just had a week of arguing the cyclists side of things and trying to get over to drivers( of which I'm one too ) to be more tolerant and relaxed. We don't often see drivers complain about horse riders, often riding 2 abreast at 3-4mph, but they always find an issue with bikes. I like to see pedestrians, bikes and horses on country roads, they're there to be used and shared, all the aforementioned are out enjoying life and making the most of it. The article below was published in our community newspaper, it saddened me that we still haven't got over a predjudice that existed between coach drivers and bikes in the early days of the bicycle. Now that cycling is popular again the contempt seems to have been re-awoken. God help everyone when the tour of britain travels the road in the article.... or should they reroute them onto cycle paths .
http://www.theambler.co.uk/2015/05/06/w ... ycle-path/
Just read the posts about motorist-cyclist and pedestrian-cyclist conflict. I've just had a week of arguing the cyclists side of things and trying to get over to drivers( of which I'm one too ) to be more tolerant and relaxed. We don't often see drivers complain about horse riders, often riding 2 abreast at 3-4mph, but they always find an issue with bikes. I like to see pedestrians, bikes and horses on country roads, they're there to be used and shared, all the aforementioned are out enjoying life and making the most of it. The article below was published in our community newspaper, it saddened me that we still haven't got over a predjudice that existed between coach drivers and bikes in the early days of the bicycle. Now that cycling is popular again the contempt seems to have been re-awoken. God help everyone when the tour of britain travels the road in the article.... or should they reroute them onto cycle paths .
http://www.theambler.co.uk/2015/05/06/w ... ycle-path/
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Re: Share the space drop your pace
According to the sign pedestrians don't have to be courteous as they have priority. In my very limited experience tow paths seem too narrow for shared use.
"It takes a genius to spot the obvious" - my old physics master.
I don't peddle bikes.
I don't peddle bikes.
Re: Share the space drop your pace
MikeF wrote:According to the sign pedestrians don't have to be courteous as they have priority. In my very limited experience tow paths seem too narrow for shared use.
There are some excellent tow paths for modern travel (as opposed for two horses towing barges)
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
Re: Share the space drop your pace
MikeF wrote:According to the sign pedestrians don't have to be courteous as they have priority. In my very limited experience tow paths seem too narrow for shared use.
2.2 metres.
http://www.cyclewoking.org.uk/aboutus/vision
Apparently the guideline is 3 metres minimum, 4 metres on busier routes!
http://www.sustrans.org.uk/sites/defaul ... routes.pdf
Obviously whereas we can constantly spend zillions widening roads for motorists, sufficiently wide paths for cycling isn't an issue.
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Re: Share the space drop your pace
I practically live on a canal edge with the back of my house just a shared path away from backing onto the canal itself. My neighbour has a garden directly onto it. We use it all the time for walking and cycling. We have a young child who loves to run along it (just over 2 years old) and use his balance bike too. The surface is a mix of tarmac and tightly packed gravel. It is perfect for cycling with wide paths that are easy to share. I have never had conflict no matter what method I use it.
I have a few rules I follow to make it safe and enjoyable for us and others. Cycle slowly - anything faster than 15mph is not safe and can alienate other users. We cycle about 8 or 9mph. Also slow down if you can not see in a distance you can stop in (without frantic application of squealing brakes). Even if that means you are at walking pace. use a bell or if not got one (get one it makes sense) then in a loud and clear voice make your presence known. Be courteous - say hello if other say it to you, even stop and talk. If you get eye contact and acknowledgement of your presence then that is a good time to say hello or other pleasantries as you pass. If you are walking you must be aware of what is around you and keep an ear and eye out for other users approaching at a faster pace. Do step out of the way - it is still your responsibility to be courteous and considerate of others. If your hearing is bad then be prepared to use your sight more and look around behind you.
Basically there are many ways as a walker, jogger and cyclist I can list to make it a better route for all. I look on it as all users have to treat other users with the respect they demand. I do not hold with any user of a byway having a higher or lower duty of care than others. I may be going against the tide here but we have to control out own actions to make it safe for ourselves and others. That is the same no matter what transport method you use. It is why I get irate over signs putting all emphasis on the cyclist taking responsibity for pedestrians or drivers taking responsibility for the safety of motorbikers.
I have a few rules I follow to make it safe and enjoyable for us and others. Cycle slowly - anything faster than 15mph is not safe and can alienate other users. We cycle about 8 or 9mph. Also slow down if you can not see in a distance you can stop in (without frantic application of squealing brakes). Even if that means you are at walking pace. use a bell or if not got one (get one it makes sense) then in a loud and clear voice make your presence known. Be courteous - say hello if other say it to you, even stop and talk. If you get eye contact and acknowledgement of your presence then that is a good time to say hello or other pleasantries as you pass. If you are walking you must be aware of what is around you and keep an ear and eye out for other users approaching at a faster pace. Do step out of the way - it is still your responsibility to be courteous and considerate of others. If your hearing is bad then be prepared to use your sight more and look around behind you.
Basically there are many ways as a walker, jogger and cyclist I can list to make it a better route for all. I look on it as all users have to treat other users with the respect they demand. I do not hold with any user of a byway having a higher or lower duty of care than others. I may be going against the tide here but we have to control out own actions to make it safe for ourselves and others. That is the same no matter what transport method you use. It is why I get irate over signs putting all emphasis on the cyclist taking responsibity for pedestrians or drivers taking responsibility for the safety of motorbikers.
Re: Share the space drop your pace
old_windbag wrote:Hi
Just read the posts about motorist-cyclist and pedestrian-cyclist conflict. I've just had a week of arguing the cyclists side of things and trying to get over to drivers( of which I'm one too ) to be more tolerant and relaxed. We don't often see drivers complain about horse riders, often riding 2 abreast at 3-4mph, but they always find an issue with bikes. I like to see pedestrians, bikes and horses on country roads, they're there to be used and shared, all the aforementioned are out enjoying life and making the most of it. The article below was published in our community newspaper, it saddened me that we still haven't got over a predjudice that existed between coach drivers and bikes in the early days of the bicycle. Now that cycling is popular again the contempt seems to have been re-awoken. God help everyone when the tour of britain travels the road in the article.... or should they reroute them onto cycle paths .
http://www.theambler.co.uk/2015/05/06/w ... ycle-path/
That particular path used to be fairly decent, good quality tarmac. Then some genius decided to resurface it in some sort of gravelly surface. They may may as well have just removed it.
Besides along that stretch there are various bits of path etc, some of which are suitable some of which very much are not and you can't tell when you first join them. Those cycle tourists don't want to have to figure that out so stay with the road.