24 miles: car slower than cycling?

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by [XAP]Bob »

mercalia wrote:bad comparison, try a motor bike or even a moped.....

Depending on the route they may or may not help. Cycle paths and other cut through a may not be available
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
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nez
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by nez »

Your right Bob. Essex road market, mount pleasant, through the little gardens and pop back out on Grays inn road. It's 35 years ago and there weren't many other cycling commuters. My son (31) tells me there's a little group of cyclists at every traffic lights in centralLondon now! Good on them
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horizon
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by horizon »

mercalia wrote:bad comparison, try a motor bike or even a moped.....


The point about the 24 miles and the car on mixed roads (not London rush hour) was that even under these favourable conditions a car requires more time if you factor in costs. A moped or motor bike wouldn't be any better. And a car could of course carry more people, thus cutting the costs. In heavy urban traffic it's well known that a bike (motorized or not) will be quicker. Quite why anyone drives in urban conditions I don't know - I presume that there is another leg to their journey which is quicker and they are wearing smart clothes.
When the pestilence strikes from the East, go far and breathe the cold air deeply. Ignore the sage, stay not indoors. Ho Ri Zon 12th Century Chinese philosopher
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syklist
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by syklist »

horizon wrote:
mercalia wrote:bad comparison, try a motor bike or even a moped.....


The point about the 24 miles and the car on mixed roads (not London rush hour) was that even under these favourable conditions a car requires more time if you factor in costs. A moped or motor bike wouldn't be any better. And a car could of course carry more people, thus cutting the costs. In heavy urban traffic it's well known that a bike (motorized or not) will be quicker. Quite why anyone drives in urban conditions I don't know - I presume that there is another leg to their journey which is quicker and they are wearing smart clothes.

This has been an interesting thread. When I was traveling to work in the Netherlands I used the train in combination with a folding bike. In the train I did my own stuff such as writing travelogues for my website. Thus my time spent traveling was either personally productive (45 mins writing in the train) and/or good for my health (4 x 10 mins cycling per day).

We're unusual here in that we walk our 18 month old to his creche and bring him home by bike. We benefit from the light exercise each day as does our child, there is no need for us to go to the gym. Everyone else seems to use their car - one couple walk home from work to pick up the car and then get their child from the creche by car (a ten minute walk away).

One day when there is no more oil our great/grand/children will ask us why we wasted so many of the earth's resources.
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toomsie
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by toomsie »

horizon wrote:Cyclist:
Time to earn £10.80 @ £8.00 per hour = 1 hr 20 mins.


Nice,... They haven't included the extra commuting time needed to earn £10.80 and the cost of the time needed to earn the petrol to pay for the petrol. Ever decreasing amounts. I am sure there is a mathematical term for this.

If you know what I mean, then you know the damage taxes can do to an economy. Extra car journeys pay for tax equals extra car journeys to pay for petrol to pay for extra car journeys. :cry: I need a vacation
Phil Fouracre
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by Phil Fouracre »

Yup, sounds like you do!
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horizon
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by horizon »

The saving only makes sense of course if you are on a low income. But you could look at it the other way round: ditch the car and you could live on a low income and have a lot more free time (and save even more money by doing some jobs yourself - like bike repairs). So that would be a lifestyle choice, not one forced on you by necessity.
When the pestilence strikes from the East, go far and breathe the cold air deeply. Ignore the sage, stay not indoors. Ho Ri Zon 12th Century Chinese philosopher
ferdinand
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by ferdinand »

Maybe :-).

Much of that 45p per mile is depreciation, and you haven't included any bike or kit, which will be a couple of thousand every few years if we are comparing to a new car.

Take it the other way, and anyone sensible can cut that 45p per mile by 50-75%.

Why do you need to be on a low income to want to save tipping money into the new car money pit?

On the speed, I discovered that the chap serving me in Evans Cycles in the city 18 miles away lives 6 doors down the road. It takes him 55 minutes on his bike, which is 20mph - A roads mainly but about 20 sets of lights too.

Ferdinand
Graham O
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by Graham O »

Looking at your analysis, you have allowed time for parking the car, but not added any time for changing into cycling clothes, getting the bike out, locking the bike up at your destination and having a shower and changing. For my journey to work, the actual journey is the same for bike and car (9 - 10 minutes), but adding on the extras, cycling is much longer. The journey home is much longer as it is all uphill and needs recovery time (unfortunately a beer :) ) when I get home.
nez
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by nez »

If it's uphill all the way home it's downhill all the way there so you don't need to change on the way there! :-)
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mjr
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by mjr »

Graham O wrote:Looking at your analysis, you have allowed time for parking the car, but not added any time for changing into cycling clothes, getting the bike out, locking the bike up at your destination and having a shower and changing.

Don't need special clothes on sensible bikes and showering need varies from person to person. No time was allowed for getting the car out or locking it up at the destination either ;)
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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syklist
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by syklist »

mjr wrote:
Graham O wrote:Looking at your analysis, you have allowed time for parking the car, but not added any time for changing into cycling clothes, getting the bike out, locking the bike up at your destination and having a shower and changing.

Don't need special clothes on sensible bikes and showering need varies from person to person. No time was allowed for getting the car out or locking it up at the destination either ;)

Is there any allowance for scraping ice and snow off the car windows in winter*? Although that might be classed as exercise thus reducing the amount of time the car driver has to spend at the gym... :)

Then there is the time spent either servicing the car yourself or taking it to the garage and making other travel arrangements.

* I actually worked with someone in the Netherlands who cycled to work in the winter and took the car in summer. He reckoned that cycling to work was less time consuming than defrosting his car.
So long and thanks for all the fish...
beardy
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by beardy »

Then there is the time spent either servicing the car yourself or taking it to the garage and making other travel arrangements.


I do as little as is needed to get my car through its MOT each year but that may involve some quite large jobs. I dont think that it will quite add up to as much time as I spend cleaning the rims and chains on my bikes. :oops:
Malaconotus
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by Malaconotus »

ferdinand wrote:Take it the other way, and anyone sensible can cut that 45p per mile by 50-75%.


Last time I did quite a lot of numbercrunching I couldn't make the total cost of ownership of any car less than 20p per mile, and one I'd want to rely on for a daily 24-mile commute was coming in a fair bit more.

And regardless of the savings that wise and frugal motoring choices could offer the actual cost per mile of motoring is rather more than 45p on average (which is why the AA and some unions want that figure raised to 55p or 60p)
drossall
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Re: 24 miles: car slower than cycling?

Post by drossall »

Richard's Bicycle Book, IIRC, quoted a study. This concluded that, if you added up the average motorist's annual mileage, and divided it by the total time spent driving the car, cleaning it, earning money for its fuel, maintenance and other expenses, and so on, it would be quicker to walk.
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