The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

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maxcherry
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The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by maxcherry »

http://www.theguardian.com/cities/2015/ ... -road-rage

The comments do not restore my faith :cry:
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horizon
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by horizon »

Nearly a third of the reported incidents involved being tailgated or passed too close, which can be terrifying because a cyclist may have nowhere to go and no control over the situation; often unable to see what is coming, only hear the threat.


There's lots to discuss on there so thanks for the link. I've quoted one bit (my emphasis): mirrors not helmets - the message must go out. Helmet promoters are doing so much damage.
When the pestilence strikes from the East, go far and breathe the cold air deeply. Ignore the sage, stay not indoors. Ho Ri Zon 12th Century Chinese philosopher
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by Vorpal »

I think that is an interesting article. I would be interested to see similar studies from other countries for comparison.
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Rhodrich
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by Rhodrich »

What a depressing article, but sadly, I can identify with so many of the comments from those cyclists who have had near misses. I commute from Surrey to Central London daily, and get close passes/ cars pulling out in front of me/ left hooks, and so much more on a regular basis. When I started commuting a couple of years ago, I can remember feeling that I couldn't put up with any more of this, and nearly packed it in. I persevered, and it doesn't bother me as much as it used to, but sadly, I'm ashamed to say that it's probably made me a lot more aggressive as a cyclist than I used to be. Someone hooting at me when I'm taking the lane through a pinch point once would have had me cycling straight to the gutter in fear. These days, something like that makes me continue in my primary position, and slow down. If it looks like someone is going to pull out in front of me, I look straight at them and cycle straight towards them (while always having a backup plan if they really don't stop). Most incidents of cars pulling out are when the driver does actually see you, but doesn't care, and expects you to stop. I've come to the help of other cyclists in similar situations, and others have come to the help of me. One particularly aggressive driver, revving his engine behind a group of us on a narrow road where it wasn't safe to pass, found his journey was slowed down greatly when one of us had an 'unfortunate' mechanical problem at the next set of traffic lights. Such a shame that 3 others had to help fix it while the lights went back from green to red as he sat in his car, hooting at us....

Unfortunately, I realise that this sort of cycling is not going to win me any favours, but it's been borne out of the real feeling of war out there on the streets of London. In the absence of proper cyling infrastructure, what else can you do? Either you take a route of ultra assertiveness, which could be perceived as aggression, or you retreat back to cars and public transport.

Then again, everything changes when I'm on a slightly different mode of transport. My rod-braked roadster forces me to slow down, and take the world in, as I pootle along at a gentle pace, imagining that we're back in the 1950's, and the roads really are made for cycling.
Cyril Haearn
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by Cyril Haearn »

The Guardian asks: Why, when the real risk is so small, are people so reluctant to cycle?

Even when one takes all possible precautions and tries to be prepared for anything, the risk feels enormous. I have been a very keen cyclist since 1973. Now I often ask myself whether I should give up cycling in the town (Lübeck, population 217 000, Germany) altogether. Outside, cycling is still fun by the canal or on separate cycle ways. In the town, it is something for bungee-jumpers and kamikazes.
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foxyrider
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by foxyrider »

Cyril Haearn wrote:The Guardian asks: Why, when the real risk is so small, are people so reluctant to cycle?

Even when one takes all possible precautions and tries to be prepared for anything, the risk feels enormous. I have been a very keen cyclist since 1973. Now I often ask myself whether I should give up cycling in the town (Lübeck, population 217 000, Germany) altogether. Outside, cycling is still fun by the canal or on separate cycle ways. In the town, it is something for bungee-jumpers and kamikazes.


Lubeck compared to the UK is like heaven! Yes i've been there several times by bike and whilst the city centre is fairly busy its nothing like Sheffield on a Sunday afternoon even at busy times! I'll swap your busy roads for my quiet ones anytime! :D please.
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horizon
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by horizon »

I feel so much safer in the town. Traffic is slower. There are more bikes. There are more stopping points like traffic lights giving you the opportunity to place yourself in front of a motor vehicle. You have so much more influence over traffic. On the fast, open road around here it's the opposite and much more challenging.

(This is just my quick response and I accept that a bit more discussion is required.)
When the pestilence strikes from the East, go far and breathe the cold air deeply. Ignore the sage, stay not indoors. Ho Ri Zon 12th Century Chinese philosopher
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Vantage
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by Vantage »

horizon wrote: There are more stopping points like traffic lights giving you the opportunity to place yourself in front of a motor vehicle. You have so much more influence over traffic.


Lately I'm finding that despite being all for stopping at red lights in the past, I am now more likely to jump them just so I don't have a dozen maniacs behind me waiting to race past at millimetre tolerances before cutting me up as they turn left.
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by kwackers »

Vantage wrote:Lately I'm finding that despite being all for stopping at red lights in the past, I am now more likely to jump them just so I don't have a dozen maniacs behind me waiting to race past at millimetre tolerances before cutting me up as they turn left.

Turns out that if there's one thing that annoys motorists more than seeing a cyclist jump a red light - it's being stuck behind a cyclist when the lights go green...

Drives them daft and thus entertains me no end. :wink:
aspiringcyclist
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by aspiringcyclist »

Reading stories like this make me more fearful of cycling than actual cycling does. I just don't seem to experience incidences like this at anywhere near the frequency implied.
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by mjr »

I endorse many of the above sentiments. Around here, it's nothing like as bad as that article makes it sound and the benefits of loads of fun commutes, dawdling along cycleways among daffodils (currently, anyway) and through parks more than makes up for the few nutters a year who pose problems. It would be good if there was more traffic policing... unmarked bobbies on bicycles riding through known trouble hotspots (which most of us avoid if we can) would catch some quite quickly.

They're relatively rare, though. I ride most days, usual minimum six miles to shops, more often ten into town, sometimes much further and I think I probably get one abusive motorist a week (hi to the prat who abused our tourists exiting Chatteris last Saturday) and maybe one dodgy movement a month (I'd suffered none for ages, then three in one ride last month!) and I wouldn't class all of them as a "near miss". Looking at the quotes on the article, it feels like most of the problems might be in cities and the smaller town quotes are more usually about abuse.

I think the key problem is that once you deal with the biggest self-inflicted contributions to cycle collisions, like staying away from doors of parked vehicles and giving way when entering a carriageway, there is often nothing people on bikes can do to stop "thoughtless to hostile behaviour" by mad motorists from putting them in danger... and that's a really scary thing. It's a shame the article doesn't offer suggestions how to change our road culture - without that, building protected cycleways won't be enough to encourage people because we still need to use carriageways for most first and last legs at least.
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Phil Fouracre
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by Phil Fouracre »

What more can I say? mjr perfectly sums up my experiences and feelings!
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mjr
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by mjr »

horizon wrote:mirrors not helmets - the message must go out. Helmet promoters are doing so much damage.

Discussion of various reasonably-current mirrors viewtopic.php?f=1&t=92027

Discussions of helmets viewforum.php?f=41
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Jason P
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Re: The Gaurdian: Cycling near misses

Post by Jason P »

Interesting - I feel quite comfortable cycling in central London on my commute, but there are roads where I live (Somerset) that I really wouldn't cycle on if you paid me (A39 I'm looking at you!) Maybe it's because I've been a motorcyclist for 20-odd years so the 'spidey sense' about what other road users are doing is second nature to me, but urban cycling is something I enjoy.
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