How Heavy is too Heavy?

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Audax67
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by Audax67 »

Four Seasons can pnucture just as well as other tyres, but they're on a par for road-holding with GP4000s which I love. The 4000s have wear tell-tales, too, which I don't think the 4-Ses do. I usually position the tell-tales over the valve: "they" say that the pressure info should go there but if you're half a cyclist you know what your pressures should be anyway, while the tell-tales take a little finding.

I get 4000 or 5000 km out of a set of 700x23s. Current set has 4000 up and the tell-tales are still visible.
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Vantage
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by Vantage »

Naw, I wouldn't feel happy running tyres that thin on my rig. 19mm internal rims and the 35mm Hypers feel a bit narrow compared to the 40mm Landcruisers as it is.
I have had an idea about maybe gluing an old innertube to the inside of the Hypers though to beef them up a bit, but I'll wait and see if my recent flats were just a short term revenge cluster attack by the pf for boasting that I never ever get flats.
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pwa
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by pwa »

I use Panracer Pasela TG on my touring bikes and find them puncture resistant and robust whilst rolling well and not weighing too much. Some people say the sidewalls are fragile, but I've been using them for years with no problems. I use the 32mm width and pump them up to 80 to 90 psi, which works well on the lanes and would probably be ideal on the lovely roads around Belmont, Turton, etc. They come in all sorts of widths. I also use Conti 4 Seasons on another bike, and although they are lovely they are, as you say, too narrow and thin for your style of bike.
Postboxer
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by Postboxer »

You could try either stripping your bike down as much as possible, or hiring, test riding or borrowing something much lighter, then going for a ride, even a short ride, to see how your pace on something lighter is.
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Vantage
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by Vantage »

Been there done that. The bike is surprisingly nippy when lugging just a spare tube, pump, levers and water bottle. I rode her that way a few times on my little 10 mile night time circuit. I was never more than 5 miles from home on that ride so doing without my creature comforts wasn't a big issue, but when I'm a long way from home it's a different world.
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mjr
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by mjr »

Let's get nitpicky weight-weenie. Sacrifice these to save weight (edit: originals now in italics):

Camera (in case I wanna take a piccie) 300g/10.5oz - use a smartphone camera unless it's a trip specifically to take pretty pictures.
3 inner tubes (no confidence at all in Hyper Voyagers pu**ture resistance) 388g/13.5oz - carry only one unless you expect the route to be dodgy or you don't have time to repair.
Pu**ture kit (as above) 23g/1oz - switch to a good brand of sticky patches.
Spare AA batteries for the garmin (guaranteed they'll die while I'm lost) 53g/2oz - ditch the garmin too and the computer and just use a smartphone or at least a gadget that you can predict the battery life on.
Cloth (for wiping mucky hands after flat repairs) 32g/1oz - use tissues and/or water bottle and/or wipes which should be in the first aid kit.
Bag for the lock (the reason for this is that the wretched thing rattles like a rusty gate in the pendle and it drives me nuts) 234g/8oz - see below about lock replacement or fix the rattle or at least use some self-vulcanising tape to pad whatever's rattling in the lock because it won't be doing it any good. I strap my rattly lock to the rack in several places and it stops it rattling (it was the plastic cover rattling on the locking bar).

That's about 800g gone right there.

I'd probably take these on almost all rides, although you could save a little weight when riding with others if you can share a pump:

Basic first aid kit which includes a couple quid 54g/2oz
Emergency blanket incase of horrific injuries from being run over by a 45ton truck, or squished by my heavy bike! :lol: 50g/1.7oz
Tissues (don't want a snotty glove) 22g/0.7oz - a few rather than a whole pack, I assume?
Mitts (might get rid of these as summer is nowhere close) 44g/1.3oz
Pump 223g/8oz
Tyre levers 30g/1oz

I'd probably look for lighter alternatives to:

Crank bros 17 tool 170g/6oz - Is it made of gold? My CPR-9 is an ounce and a Park CT-5 chain tool is another 1.5oz, which I think makes it about 70g total?
6" adjustable spanner (I'm not the only nut on my bike) 140g/5oz - my very old one is half that and it's not let me down yet.
Lock 2486g/87oz/couple tons - this is the big weight saving opportunity, but it'll cost! http://www.lfgss.com/conversations/144109/ includes a sold secure gold lock (and I don't trust that label) of 1.4kgs, although about 2kg is more common. As for the insurance requirement, I'd consider switching to one with the more typical "locked to an immovable object" clause, but even with Sold Secure, you could save 1kg there.
Pendle 610g/21.5 oz - I'd keep that for best and use a 150g lightweight drybag as a saddlebag for day-to-day stuff, saving another 460g/1lb.

So in total, it looks like about 2.5kg more than necessary, before reducing the kit capability or considering more drastic measures like taking a rack off or replacing the evil Airzound with a bell. I've no idea if it would help, but seeing as the kit list was there...
Last edited by mjr on 5 Feb 2015, 5:46pm, edited 1 time in total.
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eileithyia
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by eileithyia »

Well i am not going to trawl thru 4 pages after reading first few posts.

1. Diabetes, problems with your leg.. sounds to me like this is a disadvantage to start with.
2. Not bonked you say but riding with others and keeping up can stretch your limits and reserves a bit more than usual.
3. All that weight as others have said there are some savings to be made.
a. Camera do you really need a big camera when a small pocket sized one will do
b. That lock!!! If going out with a group into rural settings do you really need a big lock, a small lightweight one will do as often more than one bike / rider will lock bikes together with each other's locks.
c. Tools take some basic ones and only take any extras if specifically needed for a something that might not be catered for otherwise.
d. just take a couple of inner tubes and repair kit, esp if out with a group as often inner tubes are shared around if necessary.
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Vantage
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by Vantage »

I took a slightly different route, but she's 9lb lighter after a bit of work.
Front and rear racks are gone, I'll put them back on when I get round to touring.
1 inner tube and tyre lever gone and adjustable spanner gone.
Lock bag gone, using a toe strap instead to stop the rattling.
Some emergency snacks gone, there's enough to see me to the nearest shop I hope.
Camera gone, I wouldn't have time to use it with the club pace anyway.
AirZound and 1 bottle cage gone.
Kickstand gone.
Front and rear battery backup lights gone, for club days at least.
Tissues gone as I never have time to blow my nose anyway and spare rag gone as I've yet to use it even when I've had mucky fingers.

I love my bike...the lock is staying :lol:
Bill


“Ride as much or as little, or as long or as short as you feel. But ride.” ~ Eddy Merckx
It's a rich man whos children run to him when his pockets are empty.
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Vantage
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by Vantage »

P.S, thank you for all your views on this :)
Bill


“Ride as much or as little, or as long or as short as you feel. But ride.” ~ Eddy Merckx
It's a rich man whos children run to him when his pockets are empty.
mercalia
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by mercalia »

Vantage wrote:
Tonyf33 wrote:Are your scales accurate? Even with a 5.5lb lock :shock: (just why is the question I have to ask) how much extra kit do you take out with you to make all that extra weight, are you taking full size tools with you too?
My own bike is a just under 15kg including all the kit I need, the 2x mid-large pannier bags with tools, lock, pump, 2x tubes & various bungee straps are 2.8kg, then mudguards/rack, front light, 2 back lights, Video camera, computer & two cages take up the rest of the 'add-ons'.
I know how it feels to have an extra 10kg in the bags so to have to lug that around 'unladen' as it were must be hard work.
I can't get my head around a 5.5lb lock though..


I wouldn't stake my right leg on it, but the scales seem fairly accurate. I just tested this as best I can. A quoted 25.5g Fudge bar came in at 26g and a quoted 57g Cadburys Nutrigrain bar came in at 59g.
Reason for the heavy lock as above^^^
But here's the kit list as weighed earlier today...

Emergency snacks...thanks to diabetes...
Jelly babies 198g/7oz
3 Nutrigrain bars 118g/4oz
2 Fudge bars 53g/1.8oz
Glucose powder for drinks bottle 62g/2oz

Camera (in case I wanna take a piccie) 300g/10.5oz
Basic first aid kit which includes a couple quid 54g/2oz
Emergency blanket incase of horrific injuries from being run over by a 45ton truck, or squished by my heavy bike! :lol: 50g/1.7oz

Tissues (don't want a snotty glove) 22g/0.7oz
Mitts (might get rid of these as summer is nowhere close) 44g/1.3oz
3 inner tubes (no confidence at all in Hyper Voyagers pu**ture resistance) 388g/13.5oz
Pu**ture kit (as above) 23g/1oz
Crank bros 17 tool 170g/6oz
Pump 223g/8oz
Cloth (for wiping mucky hands after flat repairs) 32g/1oz
Tyre levers 30g/1oz
Spare AA batteries for the garmin (guaranteed they'll die while I'm lost) 53g/2oz
6" adjustable spanner (I'm not the only nut on my bike) 140g/5oz
Lock 2486g/87oz/couple tons
Bag for the lock (the reason for this is that the wretched thing rattles like a rusty gate in the pendle and it drives me nuts) 234g/8oz
Pendle 610g/21.5 oz

11lb right there and oddly enough I see valid reasons for everything in that list. Maybe I'm just a drama queen :shock:


no rubber gloves to stop your mitts getting dirty?
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mjr
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by mjr »

Hang on a minute: I just realised the Oxford HD 900mm is a CHAIN (including an Oxford HD Mini Shackle Lock). I used to use a chain but I think they've been overtaken by using a lighter D-lock through one wheel and triangle and an independent cable through any remaining insecure QR bits - ideally with one of them alarmed.

http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/ ... -09-35284/ says they powered through the chain in 30 seconds :( At least with two independent locks, they'd have to cut two and you might hear it and have time to react.
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CREPELLO
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by CREPELLO »

I'd difinately ditch the lock and not be governed by what one insurance company stipulates.

My security consists of a Mini Evo 2000 D lock
Image
http://www.tredz.co.uk/.Kryptonite-Evol ... _53382.htm - minus the cable, which weighs approx 700g. Instead I use Pitlock wheels skewers. If I need extra security I carry another lock. But if I'm off into the country I will only use a mini wire lock.
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Vantage
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by Vantage »

mjr wrote:http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/accessories/locks/product/review-oxford-hd-15m-chain-lock-09-35284/ says they powered through the chain in 30 seconds :( At least with two independent locks, they'd have to cut two and you might hear it and have time to react.


Test 1: The manual attack

The first test is based on our now classic breaking kit: an extending bar for leverage to twist the shackle, a hammer, pliers, mole grips, wire cutters, a chisel and the trusty axe. This is the armoury of your average thief. We also use bolt croppers – these are around 3ft long and something a bike thief could easily conceal under a coat. We have a maximum of five minutes to complete this test.

Test 2: The professional touch

Again a five-minute limit, but we’ve introduced a high-power-output portable angle grinder. This works with a rechargeable battery and has a blade rotation rate and torque levels very close to a mains-operated grinder. One cutting disc per lock is allowed. This is what today’s more professional thieves are using, according to our sources in the police.


From the testers site of their lock breaking methods.
Mine sailed through test 1 and failed miserably on test 2, but I doubt there are many locks without a seriously hefty price tag and weight that would do well here.
Test 1 and it being enough to cover the insurance needs should the worst happen is what sold it to me :)
Bill


“Ride as much or as little, or as long or as short as you feel. But ride.” ~ Eddy Merckx
It's a rich man whos children run to him when his pockets are empty.
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Vantage
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by Vantage »

CREPELLO wrote:I'd difinately ditch the lock and not be governed by what one insurance company stipulates.


If the lock fails and your bike goes walkabout, you're left without both.
If the insurance company approved lock fails and the bike goes walkabout, you're left without both but the insurance pays out and the bike can be replaced.
That's a no brainer to me.

For what it's worth and I may be worrying over nothing here, but I suspect that besides actual cyclists, there is the possibility that thieving scumbags also trawl cycling forums in the hope of finding info to make bike acquirements that little bit easier. It doesn't take a genious to find out many cyclists use toy locks in the countryside in the belief their bikes are safe. Van and bolt cropper and it's bye bye bike.
I've had roughly, 6 bikes stolen in my life, all within a year of owning them and I still remember the gut wrenching feeling in my stomach as each time I discovered them gone. My Vantage is the first bike I've personally bought ever to last more than a year under my watch. My current financial situation means it literally cannot be replaced if it disappeared. I'd rather a slow bike than a no bike :)
Bill


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It's a rich man whos children run to him when his pockets are empty.
pwa
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Re: How Heavy is too Heavy?

Post by pwa »

I live in a rural area and the risk of bike theft is very small here. Bikes are left outside houses without going missing. I've lived in my village for about 17 years and I've not heard of one bike going awol in that time. So the difference between cities and countryside on this issue is real. I also think the lock type required depends on what you expect it to do. If you are intending to lock your bike to railings in a big town then go shopping, the beefy lock is needed. But if you only intend popping into a café in a low crime area (especially in the countryside) you are very unlikely to be bothered by well-equipped bike thieves. A light lock to deter opportunistic theft will do the job. When I cycled to work I left a gold standard lock permanently on my bit of railing (employer's grounds), but I never dreamed of carrying that lump on day rides.
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