Caught on camera

Commuting, Day rides, Audax, Incidents, etc.
AlanD
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Joined: 27 Mar 2008, 1:29pm
Location: South Oxfordshire

Caught on camera

Post by AlanD »

Two weeks ago, the price of all my action camera kit finally paid off.
I was cycling to work and approaching a bend with high hedges, so you could not see round the bend. This White Transit came from behind at high speed and overtook me at the start of the bend..... Just as another car appeared the other way. :o I have a perfect recording of this car being forced off the road, then spinning out of control. The transit did not stop. The car driver was most pleased when I told him it was all videoed. The recordings are now with the Police, and his insurers, and my written Police statement was posted shortly afterwards.
Looking at the recordings that evening, I was greatly shocked by what I saw. I have no doubt that the car drivers quick action in going off the road prevented an offset head-on crash. If this had happened, I am in no doubt that I would not be telling you all about it. I would like to post the recordings for you all too see, but it's Police evidence and you can see the registration numbers, so I don't think that I should.
Oh I do so hope it goes to Court. I want my day in Court! I want to see this driver and give evidence against him.
Grandad
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Joined: 22 Nov 2007, 12:22am
Location: Kent

Re: Caught on camera

Post by Grandad »

Yes !!
LollyKat
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Joined: 28 May 2011, 11:25pm
Location: Scotland

Re: Caught on camera

Post by LollyKat »

+1

And since it is a car being forced off the road and not a mere bicycle the police might actually do something about it. :?
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[XAP]Bob
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Joined: 26 Sep 2008, 4:12pm

Re: Caught on camera

Post by [XAP]Bob »

Unfortunately he (assumption) may change his plea to guilty at the last moment...
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
reohn2
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Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Caught on camera

Post by reohn2 »

[XAP]Bob wrote:Unfortunately he (assumption) may change his plea to guilty at the last moment...

In which case he'll get a fine(£300?) and points.

*Story alert*
In the interests of symmetry if nothing else,on the last three rides I've been over take by three cars on each ride,all of which have given me lots of space two of which had the offside wheels kicking up dust on the opposite side of the road,six of those nine cars were driven by women,four of which had children in the back,one turned left 20m after completing the overtake.
ALL of them overtook me on blind right hand bends where even I on the leftside of my lane couldn't see round the bend let alone could any of these dangerous and stupid people.
As AlanD says,another car coming the other way in any one of these cases I may not have been typing this post.
What is it with these people?
-----------------------------------------------------------
"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
iviehoff
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Joined: 20 Jan 2009, 4:38pm

Re: Caught on camera

Post by iviehoff »

If they don't charge him with dangerous driving, having perfect evidence of just what happened, forcing another car off the road, then there is something wrong. But we know that already - Martin Porter has proved it in failing to persuade the CPS to prosecute for dangerous driving an incident that perfectly met the criteria. But occasionally the right thing happens. If convicted of dangerous driving, there is a mandatory disqualification of 12 months minimum.

Failing to stop is an aggravating factor in sentencing. If the car that was forced off the road suffered any injuries or damage, that is another aggravating factor.
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/s_to_u/sent ... s_driving/
But given the maximum sentence on summary conviction is 6 months, and this is nowhere near any of the seriously aggravating factors, so I wouldn't expect a custodial sentence.
thirdcrank
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Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Caught on camera

Post by thirdcrank »

The best witness is the independent witness. Best to save the gloating till later.
fretsaw
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Joined: 4 Nov 2012, 9:49pm

Re: Caught on camera

Post by fretsaw »

i once had a ambulance overtake me on a blind bend;siren on,and thank god nothing coming in the opposite direction. :oops:
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661-Pete
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Joined: 22 Nov 2012, 8:45pm
Location: Sussex

Re: Caught on camera

Post by 661-Pete »

As I understand it, failure to stop is only an offence if there are injuries to a road user or animal, or damage to another vehicle or street fixture. If, as I'm assuming, thankfully there were no injuries reported, and the other vehicle was undamaged, the van driver may not have a case to answer on this front, although he certainly ought to be nailed for Driving Without Due Care, or even Dangerous Driving.

No injuries? I wonder about situations like that. A few years ago I was involved in a very similar situation - but with a different outcome: the car that was overtaking me collided in a glancing head-on with an oncoming car. Both cars were write-offs. I went to the aid of the oncoming driver - he did not appear to be physically hurt but was plainly shaken and in shock. I would describe that as an injury - he confirmed when he wrote to me a few days later that he was still 'trying to get over it'. I too - despite not being touched - went into slight shock myself a few minutes after the event - trembling violently and all that. The police came but weren't interested in prosecutions - and I had no video footage. I only wish I had.

And - no damage? It's not clear from your account whether the oncoming car actually spun into the hedge. Even scratches on paintwork count as damage.

Anyway, I hope you get a result. People like your van driver need to be set an example.
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).
Bicycler
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Joined: 4 Dec 2013, 3:33pm

Re: Caught on camera

Post by Bicycler »

How can he know that no damage was caused if he didn't stop to see. He should have stopped to see if he was required to stop... :wink:

In all seriousness, I have had exactly this happen to me where I was the oncoming car and a white van was overtaking a cyclist on a blind bend. I ended up pretty much in the hedge too. Again, the driver of the van chose not to stop, though the cyclist did (bless him). We were both pretty shook up. Truth be told, I was glad that there was room for me to avoid it, otherwise I suspect the driver may have chosen to hit the squishy thing alongside rather than the oncoming piece of metal. Making the manoeuver was bad but not stopping to check people are alright was just wrong.
Last edited by Bicycler on 4 Aug 2014, 10:44am, edited 1 time in total.
thirdcrank
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Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Caught on camera

Post by thirdcrank »

Although some people don't like the word "accident," it's the language of the Road Traffic Acts and it has been interpreted by the higher courts more widely than "collision." That's particularly relevant to police breath testing powers after accidents. The fail to stop/report provisions have all sorts of legs, but the starting point is there has to be an "accident" causing injury or damage and then the driver has to be aware that it has happened. That's not specified in the legislation but the courts have accepted that knowledge is a requirement. The upshot of all this is that as a percentage of the cases where fail-to-stop drivers are traced, I think prosecutions are relatively low. The more serious the injuries, especially if they prove fatal, the greater the tendency for failing to stop to be treated as an aggravating factor. Again, if the motive for not stopping is to escape detection for something more serious, be that escaping a bank robbery or detection as a disqualified driver, the fail-to-stop tends to be less important in comparison with the main offence.

The obvious area of difficulty is if avoiding detection for a period of time risks frustrating the breathalyser provisions. If there is evidence that this has happened, I think it would make a fail-to-stop prosecution more likely, dependent on the availability of the evidence. Back-calculations of blood alcohol also permissible in some circumstances.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/52/section/170
thirdcrank
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Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Caught on camera

Post by thirdcrank »

An interesting report of a prosecution for failing to stop here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-br ... e-28658217
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jezer
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Location: North Wiltshire

Re: Caught on camera

Post by jezer »

Just looked at the link. What an appalling record as a driver, and he's aiming to be at the heart of the next government :shock:
Power to the pedals
snibgo
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Joined: 29 Jun 2010, 4:45am

Re: Caught on camera

Post by snibgo »

A potential difficulty with the OP case is finding the driver. A rear-facing camera might have caught his face; a front-facing one wouldn't. So it is possible that the maximum prosecution will be for failing to furnish the driver's details.
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661-Pete
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Re: Caught on camera

Post by 661-Pete »

thirdcrank wrote:An interesting report of a prosecution for failing to stop here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-br ... e-28658217

Let's not over-egg this particular incident (and no - I'm not a Labour supporter at the present time!) Looks like a fairly venial offence, a parking shunt, minor damage, no injuries, and he claims he was unaware of having caused any damage at the time. His past record, however, is more damning.
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
--- Arthur Eddington (creator of the Eddington Number).
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