Chipping ******

[MikeF]

Much damage to roads is caused by utility services digging up the road and not properly reinstating the damage. Councils often get the blame not repairing this damage. There needs to be more onus on utility companies for ensuring a lasting repair.
Surrey CC has relaid some roads, at least in the south east corner of the county, with an excellent surface, and some very minor ones too. However they still have to repair some roads they designate as "Surrey Cycleways"

[mjr]

Councils should get the blame. They are responsible for monitoring street works and making utilities do them properly, including reinstatement. Very few utility works in west Norfolk comply with the law as far as I can tell. Inconvenience for cyclists is unusual and a good result... more often, they're downright dangerous, ranging from open unfenced pits to head height spikes in the last eighteen months.

I suspect cuts have left the county council with too few people to do the work properly.

[Mick F]

When John Loudon McAdam re-designed the Roman system for road building, he had a graded stone surface with a fine gravel on the top. This worked well and was exported all over the world. The newly designed turnpikes used his surface and coach loads of people went up and down the county at speeds unheard of in previous times.

Trouble was, as the speeds increased and the coaches became bigger and heavier, and the Royal Mail coaches delivered the mail up and down the country, and the number of horses increased, galloping along to tow these iron wheeled monsters, the road surfaces became rutted and damaged. It was a constant task in repairing and remaking, but labour was cheap and plentiful, so it was done quickly and easily.

Trouble was, this situation couldn't carry on. In USA for instance, long droughts turned their macadam roads to piles of dust, so some bright spark thought of tarring the roads. At a stroke, the roads became smoother and cleaner and hard-wearing.

Fast forward 150 years.
History is repeating itself, but labour isn't cheap and plentiful any more.

[rjb]

It's called "surface dressing" here in Somerset. Helpfully the council put up warning signs a couple of weeks in advance and it's also easy to check on their website for future schedules.

[MikeF]

Councils should get the blame. They are responsible for monitoring street works and making utilities do them properly, including reinstatement. Very few utility works in west Norfolk comply with the law as far as I can tell. Inconvenience for cyclists is unusual and a good result... more often, they're downright dangerous, ranging from open unfenced pits to head height spikes in the last eighteen months.

I think the reinstatement requirement is that it must not deteriorate within 6 months, or else the utility service is required to make good. However that time is far too short in reality, and that's why many potholes and ruts form. The councils can operate only within conditions set out for them. Much long term damage is caused by utility services, but so long as the repair is effective for a relatively short period of time, there isn't an obligation on them to carry out further repairs. What needs changing is the liability of repair for the utility services!

[Psamathe]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dg3StO-7zZY

(Terrible quality but it is rather old). And I remember seeing it on TV years ago.

Ian

[Flinders]

Geez, I know what you mean. I cycled up onto Ruabon moor from Minerva up a steady mile or so incline a few days back. A year ago they completely resurfaced it in silky smooth tarmac - what a pleasure to ride up.

Now they've covered all that lovely black stuff with piles of very course chippings and lashings of tar. Consequently a had a chipping getting stuck to the front tyre every couple of rev's and spat out at the top. Tedious. (At least the 4x4 moton did his silly wheelspin in the chippings just before I joined the road)

Why do they do this? I can understand that when the surface starts to break up it helps seal it, but it shouldn't break up in one year, unless it was defective.

Sorry, a bit ranty

They did that round here. When the smooth surface went on we were told that the smooth surface had to stay down for a few months and then chippings would go on. The smooth stuff was great for cycling, but lethal for horses, far too slippy for the metal shoes, hence my horse owner friend inquiring. Sure enough, the chippings did go on, and it was horrible for cycling afterwards. The smooth surface was a joy to cycle on while it lasted though.

[nomisp]

Hi , Yesterday Hertfordshire CC laid a tarmac base and covered it with chippings and quickly rolled them in and then cleared off, leaving cardboard signs which recommended a max speed of 10 mph. This morning the road looked so dangerous to cycle on that I took to the footpath for the duration of it. There were strips of loose chipping everywhere excepy on the two tracks made by vehicle tyres. There was also the thick clouds of dust made by every vehicle driving along which just seemed to hang about like a fog. It would seem that the council expect the vehicles to do the compacting of the chippings into the new surface and then for them to come round after a few days and hoover up the excess, which is fine if you are in a car. To cap it all I got hit on the head by a stone chipping as a car speed along in a cloud of dust looking like "Toad of toad hall. Have not tried it on a motorbike yet but I assume it will be as dangerous and unsafe as riding the bike . Nomisp

[mjr]

This morning the road looked so dangerous to cycle on that I [...]

Take pictures. Report in fairly strong but polite terms on www.fixmystreet.com which also publishes it then if someone does get seriously hurt, that council can't deny knowledge.

[Psamathe]

This morning the road looked so dangerous to cycle on that I [...]

Take pictures. Report in fairly strong but polite terms on http://www.fixmystreet.com which also publishes it then if someone does get seriously hurt, that council can't deny knowledge.

Or use FillThatGole.org.uk (the CTC's version of the same). Personally I switched from FicMyStreet to FillThatHole 'cos FillThat Hole was easier to use and more "responsive".

But it comes down to personal choice.

Ian

[mjr]

Isn't fill that hole for.. well... holes, rather than botched work?

[Psamathe]

Isn't fill that hole for.. well... holes, rather than botched work?

(Apologies to OP for my going a bit off-topic)
Fill that hole includes a number of categories: Pothole, Uneven manhole/drain, Rut or gully, Debris on road, Poor roadwork repair or Other. And for any of the categories you can enter a text description of the issue.

But I'm not trying to push one system over any other. People have their preferences based on all sorts of reasons. I suppose in my case I use the iPhone app (which needs some work) but does make reporting potholes whilst out on a ride really easy (in my case I record them using the app and upload the report later, but that is just how I use it). Useful as I seem to report quite a lot of hazards !

Ian

[iviehoff]

Hi , Yesterday Hertfordshire CC laid a tarmac base and covered it with chippings and quickly rolled them in and then cleared off, leaving cardboard signs which recommended a max speed of 10 mph.

Do you mean tar or tarmac. If it was tarmac this isn't surface dressing.

I live close to the Bucks/Herts border, and cross it each morning on my way to the station. My experience is that Bucks surface dresses roads, and Herts doesn't, I've never seen any surface dressing happening on the Herts roads I regularly use. The Bucks road I live on gets a surface dressing from time to time, and whilst it is briefly annoying in the long run I am very grateful for it. It has always been done well, and any local defects resulting have been fixed on a return visit. I live on a road with few holes in it precisely because the regular maintenance keeps the road in good condition; when I cross to Herts it's pothole dodging time. Though elsewhere there are roads in terrible condition in Bucks.

[[XAP]Bob]

Surface dressing would be OK if they did the compacting work and cleared up the piles of gravel.

One road I commute on STILL has pules of chippings in the middle of the lanes 12-18 months after it was "dressed". The problem is that at pinch points there is noone who runs "offline"...

On a bike of course the centre line is the most attractive from a safety from other traffic point of view, but it is still potentially lethal long after any of the signs (which weren't in advance) have gone.

The other way down the hill has had 50% of the road resurfaced properly, and that's gorgeous!