Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

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thirdcrank
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Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by thirdcrank »

AndyBSG wrote:The driver behind this crash has been charged.

Given that it's almost a year since the killing i'm guessing he's been charged because the CPS beleive there is enough evidence to secure a conviction which is a good thing but I wonder already how laughably lenient his sentence will be.

They should throw the book at him just on the fact he was driving without insurance and some action should be taken against the company that was employing him because that's disgusting for an HGV to be driven under those circumstances. Would be interested to know what the 'licence offence' is, does that mean he didn't have a licence?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-27993540


The CPS can only start proceedings if there is sufficient evidence to have a good chance of conviction AND a prosecution is in the public interest. It's normal for a company to be prosecuted if an employee is prosecuted for alleged licensing and insurance offences using a company vehicle on the company's business. There are various driving licence offences, of which not having a licence is only one.

As it's going to court, prejudicial discussion may not be helpful.
ukdodger
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Joined: 18 Aug 2007, 5:32pm
Location: Sunny Surrey

Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by ukdodger »

AndyBSG wrote:The driver behind this crash has been charged.

Given that it's almost a year since the killing i'm guessing he's been charged because the CPS beleive there is enough evidence to secure a conviction which is a good thing but I wonder already how laughably lenient his sentence will be.

They should throw the book at him just on the fact he was driving without insurance and some action should be taken against the company that was employing him because that's disgusting for an HGV to be driven under those circumstances. Would be interested to know what the 'licence offence' is, does that mean he didn't have a licence?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-27993540


Shame it doesnt say exactly what happened. I'd guess two years suspended.

Lorries scare me more than any other vehicle when I'm out. With the possible exception of the teenage yobbo in his firms van.
AndyBSG
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Joined: 10 Jul 2013, 11:16am

Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by AndyBSG »

Turns out the 'licence offence' was that he did not have a valid licence for the class of vehicle he was driving.

So, sounds like he only had a standard car licence if he passed his test before 1997, which at 52 years old I would assume he did, and not a valid HGV class 2 licence which requires a completely separate test and licence.
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John1054
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Location: Sunshine Coast

Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by John1054 »

I had to take a HGV test back in 1976. I don't know how far you would have to go back to drive HGV without a separate test?
garybaldy
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Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by garybaldy »

2nd Feb 1970 was the date when HGV tests were introduced. I believe you had to be driving HGV's for six months continuously prior to that to claim "grandfathers rights" though I'm not exactly sure about that. I passed my HGV1 in October 1977
AndyBSG
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Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by AndyBSG »

If you got a licence before 1990 then you could drive a 7.5 tonne lorry without an HGV licence or any form of additional training.

It was complete madness because 7.5 tonnes are completely different to drive to cars and much more like driving an artic with regards to blind spots, swing and clearance on turns, etc which is why it was changed in 1990 to bring in the test for them
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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by [XAP]Bob »

AndyBSG wrote:If you got a licence before 1990 then you could drive a 7.5 tonne lorry without an HGV licence or any form of additional training.

It was complete madness because 7.5 tonnes are completely different to drive to cars and much more like driving an artic with regards to blind spots, swing and clearance on turns, etc which is why it was changed in 1990 to bring in the test for them


I'm happy enough driving big box vans etc, but 7.5 tonne is huge!
I would probably be OK - but I'd absolutely want my wife or father with me as a banks-man when slow and a secondary observer when driving (just two people I'd trust in that role - there are a few more, but not many)
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
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SleepyJoe
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Joined: 30 Sep 2010, 12:16pm
Location: North Devon

Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by SleepyJoe »

I have a paper licence as I haven't moved house in a while and I passed my test in 1983 and I passed in a Ford Fiesta type car
This allows me to still drive a category C1 lorry (3 1/2 tonne unladed, 7 1/2 tonne max weight) which I have done a couple of times
Not so bad around decent roads as long as you use our wing mirrors and steer later than normal.
The really scary option, is that I also have C1E which is a 3 1/2 tonne lorry towing a trailer with a maximum weight of 12 tonnes!
I haven't tried this and don't really want to either!
That is a huge difference from a 3 door hatchback
Mark
thirdcrank
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Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm

Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by thirdcrank »

FWIW, my driving licence issued in 1978 (test passed in 1965) Is for groups

A: Any motor vehicle other than: a road roller, vehicle steered by its tracks, invalid carriage, trolley vehicle.

D Any motor bicycle, with or without sidecar

E Moped.

A footnote explains that "You must obtain an additional licence before driving a heavy goods vehicle or a public service vehicle."

There must be plenty more with similar entitlements about.
Flinders
Posts: 3023
Joined: 10 Mar 2009, 6:47pm

Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by Flinders »

SleepyJoe wrote:I have a paper licence as I haven't moved house in a while and I passed my test in 1983 and I passed in a Ford Fiesta type car
This allows me to still drive a category C1 lorry (3 1/2 tonne unladed, 7 1/2 tonne max weight) which I have done a couple of times
Not so bad around decent roads as long as you use our wing mirrors and steer later than normal.
The really scary option, is that I also have C1E which is a 3 1/2 tonne lorry towing a trailer with a maximum weight of 12 tonnes!
I haven't tried this and don't really want to either!
That is a huge difference from a 3 door hatchback
Mark


I think mine's the same, and I wouldn't want to drive anything that size either, not without a bit of instruction of some sort.
Never having had the need for it to be 'sent in', my licence doesn't even have a photo, which was a pain when I didn't have a currently valid passport, as I had no photo ID at all... :? These days, you have to have photo ID for so many things.
SleepyJoe
Posts: 152
Joined: 30 Sep 2010, 12:16pm
Location: North Devon

Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by SleepyJoe »

Flinders

At least neither of us have to bother with paying for a new photo licence every 10 years!
I get a few odd looks when I am asked for my licence and I pull out my dog eared, almost falling apart licence.
I have to be careful to refold correctly or it will disintegrate.

Mark
axel_knutt
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Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by axel_knutt »

I haven't really got a clue what my licence covers me to drive, but as long as it includes a car it'll do. When is a licence deemed to be issued? I passed my test in 1976, had paper licences issued in 1976 and 1994, and now have a photocard which runs from 2005 to 2015. On the back of the photocard the list of categories all run from 1976 to 2028. The biggest things I've ever driven are a Bedford CF, and a CF Luton.
“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”
― Friedrich Nietzsche
Quaker Mike
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Joined: 5 Jan 2007, 9:29pm
Location: East Kent

Re: Another cyclist killed by lorry in London

Post by Quaker Mike »

I got my first licence in 1953 ( I still have it somewhere, a natty little booklet with a red cloth reinforced cover). I drove several pre and post-war bangers (family cars) using it, and then in 1964 a brand new Bedford tipper. The Bedford was far easier to drive than some of the bangers!
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