Cycling in groups

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martinn
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Cycling in groups

Post by martinn »

Hi All,

I will be undertaking a charity ride over the May B/H weekend, and as we are riding in a group of 12 on a mixture of roads over three days and 300 miles. How should we ride?

Should we ride as a group of 12, singleing up or doubling up as the road condicitons allow, or should we ride in say two groups of 6 doing the same thing?

would the latter giving a gap allow for safer overtaking? so cars can overtake a smaller group and not be tempted to take a risky overtake on a larger group.

Anyway any advice welcomed.

Thanks
Martin
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hondated
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by hondated »

Definitely two groups of six I would say and smaller if traffic dictates. Enjoy your ride.
reohn2
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by reohn2 »

I'd say a tight group of 12 doubled up ie;two abreast,six twos,is about the same size as a slow moving tractor and small trailer,which IMO is better than two sixes.
Singling out into a line of 12 riders is asking for close overtakes and vehicles cutting in due to mistimed overtakes with oncoming traffic,I'd only single out when it's safe for the whole group and not because of vehicular pressure.Of course if the group is causing major tailbacks I'd stop and let it clear.
That said,a Bank Holiday w/end is possibly one of the worse times to be riding,I understand your group's possible constraints of work ,etc,but the roads are usually packed,so whatever you do you'll more than likely get some abuse from some motorists.
I try not to ride on B/holiday w/ends because the roads have more than their fair share of idiots driving cars at that time,especially if the weather's good.
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DaveGos
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by DaveGos »

The group may split naturally during the ride . I think 12 is fine as long as your ride double file on B roads and single out if traffic builds up or road is narrow . You can even call traffic past on narrow raods if the head of the group has a good view. I avoid A roads
Grandad
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by Grandad »

You can even call traffic past on narrow raods if the head of the group has a good view.


My club specifically bans waving drivers past. The reason is that you do not know what type of driver is waiting - is it a very positive one who will get past quickly and safely or an indecisive one who will take so long to get past that on oncoming vehicle could appear before they have completed the overtake. There is also the possibility that in the latter circumstance the cyclists might face a claim that they were at least partially to blame.
flatout
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by flatout »

Yes, waving drivers through can open up another can of worms. Our club discourage it, but that doesn’t stop people, who don’t read the guidelines, from doing it.

But all of the advice is contextual. Different days, roads, visibility lines, traffic densities, weather conditions, experience and compactness of your group, etc, etc. Some days you seem to win and others can be very character building!
ambodach
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by ambodach »

Depends on the width of road. Generally a line of 12 singled out on narrow roads is a nightmare for following drivers trying to find enough view ahead to overtake safely. Two groups of 6 would be my preference.
I do not wave drivers past but I indicate with my left arm that I am keeping left and know they are there and prepared for an overtake. The onus is then on the following vehicle to decide if it is safe or not.
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squeaker
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by squeaker »

3 groups of 2x2 with sensible spacing between groups. 2x2 is roughly car sized....

But then I hate riding in big groups :roll:
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Vorpal
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by Vorpal »

I don't think it much matters, although a group of 12 all together could be hard to overtake.

3 groups of 4, riding two abreast might be the most space effective arrangement, but the best thing is to discuss it with your group.

Maybe they want to mix it up a bit so people can socialize, when possible?

I have to admit that when I've ridden with groups, we've just let our group sort of arrange themselves naturally, and only made sure there was a bit of separation to facilitate overtaking.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom
james01
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by james01 »

Cycling in a large compact group can sometimes, but not always, be the safest method. The downside is that you really need to trust fellow riders not to do something stupid like sudden braking/swerving etc. Charity runs can often include riders who have never experienced this kind of riding; havoc can be the result :shock:
reohn2
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by reohn2 »

Vorpal wrote:I don't think it much matters, although a group of 12 all together could be hard to overtake.

3 groups of 4, riding two abreast might be the most space effective arrangement, but the best thing is to discuss it with your group.

Maybe they want to mix it up a bit so people can socialize, when possible?


I don't understand how three groups of four cause less disruption to motor traffic than a doubled up group of 12.
In the 2x2x3 format motors have to negotiate three groups,which IMO trebles their possible irritability factor,thereby increasing the punishment pass risky overtake for the last group enccountered.
Whereas the 2x6 is a hazard needing one manoeuvre,one irritability factor,whatever the road type unless it's singletrack roads with clear views ahead then single file 1x12 works better IMHO.
The other point is a 2x6 group has more 'presence' ie; not as easily bullied by nutters who think UK roads are only for cars and cars alone and little tolerance for others :) .
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LollyKat
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by LollyKat »

It depends on the road, though. A couple of years ago we were driving on a country road (the A809 between Drymen and Glasgow) and got stuck for a couple of miles behind a six cyclists riding in single file. The road is reasonably wide but not wide enough to overtake a single cyclist safely if there is an oncoming car. It is also quite twisty and lumpy so the sightlines weren't good enough to be able to pass a line of six, which is actually quite long. If they had been riding two, or even better three abreast, we could have overtaken.

By the time they turned off they had collected quite a queue. We were the first car behind them so could 'protect' them, and no-one else seemed bothered, but we speculated how surprised the cyclists would be if we shouted at them, "you should be riding abreast!"
reohn2
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by reohn2 »

LollyKat wrote:It depends on the road, though. A couple of years ago we were driving on a country road (the A809 between Drymen and Glasgow) and got stuck for a couple of miles behind a six cyclists riding in single file. The road is reasonably wide but not wide enough to overtake a single cyclist safely if there is an oncoming car. It is also quite twisty and lumpy so the sightlines weren't good enough to be able to pass a line of six, which is actually quite long. If they had been riding two, or even better three abreast, we could have overtaken.

By the time they turned off they had collected quite a queue. We were the first car behind them so could 'protect' them, and no-one else seemed bothered, but we speculated how surprised the cyclists would be if we shouted at them, "you should be riding abreast!"


IMO they should've pulled over to let the traffic clear if they were 'collecting' traffic six or more cars with no chance of overtaking is a sign to stop and allow them to get by.
It makes for less chance of someone taking chances or getting irate and frustrated,such actions also make for good for(get ready for it) 'intervecular relations'* :wink:

*my phrase for the day :)
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
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Vorpal
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by Vorpal »

reohn2 wrote:
Vorpal wrote:I don't think it much matters, although a group of 12 all together could be hard to overtake.

3 groups of 4, riding two abreast might be the most space effective arrangement, but the best thing is to discuss it with your group.

Maybe they want to mix it up a bit so people can socialize, when possible?


I don't understand how three groups of four cause less disruption to motor traffic than a doubled up group of 12.
In the 2x2x3 format motors have to negotiate three groups,which IMO trebles their possible irritability factor,thereby increasing the punishment pass risky overtake for the last group enccountered.
Whereas the 2x6 is a hazard needing one manoeuvre,one irritability factor,whatever the road type unless it's singletrack roads with clear views ahead then single file 1x12 works better IMHO.
The other point is a 2x6 group has more 'presence' ie; not as easily bullied by nutters who think UK roads are only for cars and cars alone and little tolerance for others :) .

The nutters will nut, whatever we do. Maybe 2 groups of 6 is better. As long there are gaps sufficent for overtaking, I don't think it much matters. Anyway, most groups have a few folks who are a bit slower or faster than the others, and tend to break up naturally. The main thing is to stay in 2 or 3 groups, and not become a long, strung out group.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom
reohn2
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Re: Cycling in groups

Post by reohn2 »

Vorpal wrote:..... Maybe 2 groups of 6 is better. As long there are gaps sufficent for overtaking, I don't think it much matters. Anyway, most groups have a few folks who are a bit slower or faster than the others, and tend to break up naturally. The main thing is to stay in 2 or 3 groups, and not become a long, strung out group.

We shall have to agree to disagree :)

The nutters will nut

:lol: :lol: :lol: Ain't that the truth,and IMO unfortunately the UK has more than it fair share :?
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
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