"Merging" onto a lane? & resulting road rage...

[Raph]

Just wondering whether to register a road rage incident.

A van driver tried to run me off the road, he was behind me, overtook and then tried to edge me into a traffic island.

BUT... in fairness to him, I'd joined the stationary lane from the left, and was sitting in front of him for quite a while waiting for the lights to change, then when the lights did change, he honked and did the above.

SO... he probably thought that he owned that bit of road and I shouldn't be joining "his" lane. I've had people do that when I'm driving, whereas I tend to let people in if they want to move into "my" lane in front of me.

So the question is, given he had lots of time to see that I was there in front of him, does he get a bit of sympathy for feeling his territory was usurped, or whatever?

Just wondering whether I was partly in the wrong for joining a lane without the driver behind me giving some kind of consent, even though he wasn't actually going anywhere at the time, and we then sat there for most of a minute before he went mental.

Also, out of sheer bloody-mindedness I stuck to my guns and got through the narrow gap just to spite him. I know that doesn't go down well, you're supposed to let aggressive drivers have their way, so I'm wondering if that is also a point against me. Not sure if any of it excuses him trying very deliberately to shove me into a traffic island but maybe I share some of the blame for stoking up his already well-developed sense of outrage.

It was also really funny cos he only went barely a hundred yards and then was stuck behind a juggernaut again as I sailed past him. He was prolific with the colourful lingo, and untypically I managed to avoid any blue vocabulary myself.

I can put the videos up if it helps to clarify anything.

[gaz]

... Not sure if any of it excuses him trying very deliberately to shove me into a traffic island ...

I'm quite sure that nothing can excuse someone from trying very deliberately to shove you into a traffic island.

Whether or not it's worth reporting is your judgement call.

[Elizabethsdad]

I had a slightly unsettling experience today. I was pulling out of one minor road turning right onto another - I had checked before pulling out but when I was three quarters the way into the manouver a car come bearing down on my from my right. He then swerves further into my side of the road - blocking me from completing the turn - before screeching to a halt and revving his diesel engine so hard the exhaust produced a huge plume of black smoke. I don't know if I didn't see him approach because he was driving fast and so didn't register when I checked or if he had just pulled away from having been parked along the road - my bad for not taking an extra second to be sure. I do think his response was deliberate and meant to be intimidating as a punishment - no matter the error I made it didn't warrant that kind of aggression. I noticed also afterwards that his burst of exhaust had left a large black mark on the tarmac, hopefully that will mean his heap fails it's emissions test at the next MOT, assuming he bothers which such formalities.

[Raph]

The amazing thing is that the drivers that are the most self-righteous are the ones who obviously haven't read the highway code and wouldn't have a leg to stand on if it came to court. If you're going to be self-righteously indignant, at least be right. A minibus driver turned left off a main road recently and nearly took out my 12yr old; it's very clear in the highway code, if you're turning left off a main road, let people complete the crossing... but no, the guy went mental on a self-righteous rant.

I used to live in London, daily road rage was the norm, the area I live in now is pretty good but I get the feeling it's deteriorating. If the situation above comes up again, I mean if I'm having to join the RH lane to turn right, I'll probably just cross the road on foot (that annoys them too!) and start again rather than try and change lanes. But I often think that the approach of leaving the road to the nutters is the wrong one. Just cos they're scary, they get the road to themselves. Not a good way to go.

[Raph]

Here it is. The road is obviously wide enough for both of us, but he's determined I shouldn't get through. I can't work out what his problem is.

https://vimeo.com/138895146

[irc]

Clip not playing in Firefox on my PC.

[stewartpratt]

So the question is, given he had lots of time to see that I was there in front of him, does he get a bit of sympathy for feeling his territory was usurped, or whatever?

It's not his territory, so no.

[Bicycler]

+1

OTOH if you are getting in front of a vehicle it really is best to actually get in front of it, not occupy a space to the side of the lane which is almost an invitation to the inconsiderate and incompetent to pull alongside into the pinch point. I'm also not sure it's wise to filter up that left hand turning lane. It seems to have put you in an awkward position between lanes.

Here it is. The road is obviously wide enough for both of us, but he's determined I shouldn't get through.

It might be that the video isn't clear but it really doesn't look like there is room for both of you to be side by side in that lane. The wagon up ahead takes up the whole lane width and the van probably isn't all that much narrower. I wouldn't feel comfortable anyway.

[Raph]

That's cos he squeezes in - I've often shared that lane with vans at that point without any problems.

More of a grey area for me is whether he felt that my bypassing a long traffic queue on an empty lane was sort of "cheating" and I shouldn't get away with it. Same happens on motorways where a slip road joins a clogged up or slow moving carriageway, drivers are very reluctant to let newcomers in.

I don't think this is the sort of guy you could reason with so I've passed it on and a police officer is going to get in touch with the company. Not sure I'll get to hear what the result is.

[Bicycler]

More of a grey area for me is whether he felt that my bypassing a long traffic queue on an empty lane was sort of "cheating" and I shouldn't get away with it.

Undoubtedly that's how he felt. Lots of drivers view it as a queue in which every one has to wait their turn and any cyclist who filters is pushing in. I don't really buy into it, the queue exists because of the size of motor vehicles and the right of smaller vehicles to filter past it is fairly established. That said, we all need to decide whether it's wise in an individual case depending on the particular road environment. Whether it's right to use a left filter lane to bypass a queue is a bit more arguable. It's probably a bit naughty. I don't really have a problem with it in principle but personally I'd avoid doing it because it runs the risk of ending up between two streams of moving traffic.

[irc]

Bad road positioning by the OP. Light is at red. Traffic stopped. In a lane that narrow I'd be either at the front, ahead of the Morrisons van, if safe, or no further forward than where I could get stopped right in the middle of the lane. Be part of the queue, not dependent on other vehicles to let me share lane. Poss bad driving by van (though up to road user changing lane to be sure there is a gap) but better road positioning would have avoided it altogether.

[Raph]

Bad road positioning by the OP. Light is at red. Traffic stopped. In a lane that narrow I'd be either at the front, ahead of the Morrisons van, if safe, or no further forward than where I could get stopped right in the middle of the lane. Be part of the queue, not dependent on other vehicles to let me share lane. Poss bad driving by van (though up to road user changing lane to be sure there is a gap) but better road positioning would have avoided it altogether.

Yes, with the benefit of hindsight I agree I should have either got properly right in the gap and had the road rage argument before we moved off, or not got in there at all.

But that implies that if there's a long traffic queue, you always have to join the queue at the back end, because wherever you join, you'll be cutting in on someone. Obviously as a motorist I wouldn't use an empty lane to jump the queue, but on a bike? Unlike a car doing that I wasn't stopping him going anywhere. If a cyclist gets in front of me when I'm driving I let them in, what's the big deal? Just out of interest would you do what he did?

And: "poss" bad driving??? What's "poss" about using your vehicle as a weapon? The vid confirms he was behind me, and deliberately got in front so as to shove me into a traffic island, which he failed at so went all four-letter-worded. I don't see the "poss" bit in the bad driving.

I put it on the roadjustice site as "partly" my fault, cos I acknowledge that a) I snuck into a lane of traffic (albeit a stationary one!), and b) I escalated the scuffle by not just letting him go first as he was so very keen to do (and then get stuck again 100yds later!)

I'm even less proud of the fact that I laughed at him afterwards as I went past him, but I just couldn't help it. Oooh you big strong scary hunk of a man, I'm so scared of your big muscles and your big grown-up scary f-words!!!... no way! I just laughed in his face and pointed out how badly positioned he was at the next traffic light (about a foot and a half over the line!). Hopefully he won't take that as a cue to go and mow down the next cyclist he sees.

[PH]

Bad road positioning by the OP. Light is at red. Traffic stopped. In a lane that narrow I'd be either at the front, ahead of the Morrisons van, if safe, or no further forward than where I could get stopped right in the middle of the lane. Be part of the queue, not dependent on other vehicles to let me share lane. Poss bad driving by van (though up to road user changing lane to be sure there is a gap) but better road positioning would have avoided it altogether.

I think that's about right, though nothing excuses aggression on the road.
You weren't merging, you were changing lanes, follow the Highway Code advise for doing so.
OTOH I might have used that lane with caution, I'd have changed lanes earlier, maybe 2 or 3 vehicles further back, still probably enough to get through the lights in that cycle and before the the lights I'd have been in the middle of the lane.

[irc]

Bad road positioning by the OP. Light is at red. Traffic stopped. In a lane that narrow I'd be either at the front, ahead of the Morrisons van, if safe, or no further forward than where I could get stopped right in the middle of the lane. Be part of the queue, not dependent on other vehicles to let me share lane. Poss bad driving by van (though up to road user changing lane to be sure there is a gap) but better road positioning would have avoided it altogether.

Yes, with the benefit of hindsight I agree I should have either got properly right in the gap

Glad we agree on that. Better preventing a problem from happening than dealing with the consequences afterwards.

[Raph]

Except that everybody else, very much myself included, cooperates on the road. Cyclists and motorists alike do that all the time, I just give way whether driving or riding. Remember this was stationary traffic - I couldn't actually "cut him up" - he wasn't moving! Maybe I haven't made that clear yet. We were there for almost a minute before moving off, during that time he didn't remonstrate or object in any way.

Just checking - arriving at the back of a 200yd traffic queue, you'd just stay at the back would you? I often do that if there's no space either side.