My local authority Derby City Council do not display the terms and conditions of use bar to say that empty lockers will have their padlocks removed, fine.
Unstipulated is their notion that the lockers are only to be used for day commuting - there is nothing to say the lockers are to be used in this way. There is no charge for the use of the lockers which are attached to public car parks.
Are they required to stipulat how they require the lockers to be used - what rights of redress do I have is they bust the lock and remove the bike and contents?
They state it has been left unoccupied and have witness statements to prove it -i am waiitng on the said statements,
Thanks in advance,
Toby
cycle Lockers -display of use of terms and conditions
Re: cycle Lockers -display of use of terms and condition
If they've not displayed any T&C's then even dropping the padlock without warning is harsh
If they've said that empty lockers will be opened then is it easy to see the contents?
Was it abandoned?
If they've said that empty lockers will be opened then is it easy to see the contents?
Was it abandoned?
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
Re: cycle Lockers -display of use of terms and condition
No the locker was occupied all the way through the period they are talking about.
Its quite possible to see the inside of the locker ( with the aid of a torch )
Toby
Its quite possible to see the inside of the locker ( with the aid of a torch )
Toby
Re: cycle Lockers -display of use of terms and condition
Derby City Council's website mentions the lockers in it's section on cycle security.
The cycle has been removed from the locker. You didn't remove it. The council state that they did not remove and impound it. Therefore it has been stolen.
Report the matter to the police. Ask the council for the date and time that they accessed the locker. If there is any CCTV footage of the council opening the locker it will determine whether the council removed your cycle or not.
The cycle has been removed from the locker. You didn't remove it. The council state that they did not remove and impound it. Therefore it has been stolen.
Report the matter to the police. Ask the council for the date and time that they accessed the locker. If there is any CCTV footage of the council opening the locker it will determine whether the council removed your cycle or not.
High on a cocktail of flossy teacakes and marmalade
Re: cycle Lockers -display of use of terms and condition
Gaz,
sorry I didn't mean to give the impression the locker has had the lock broken -it hasn't -yet.
There is a notice on the door saying that locks on unoccupied lockers will be broken.
It has since occurred to me that in order to ensure I retain my property I might as well empty it as this is one route to making sure I still have it.
Its quite true I could do as you suggest but I've no idea what action (court?) i would have to take to retrieve it and its a l ittle more than ironic that i'm taking action to make sure my property is safe by withdrawing it from somewhere I thought it was more likely to be so,
Toby
sorry I didn't mean to give the impression the locker has had the lock broken -it hasn't -yet.
There is a notice on the door saying that locks on unoccupied lockers will be broken.
It has since occurred to me that in order to ensure I retain my property I might as well empty it as this is one route to making sure I still have it.
Its quite true I could do as you suggest but I've no idea what action (court?) i would have to take to retrieve it and its a l ittle more than ironic that i'm taking action to make sure my property is safe by withdrawing it from somewhere I thought it was more likely to be so,
Toby
Re: cycle Lockers -display of use of terms and condition
Sorry Toby, I misinterpreted your opening post. 
Previous thread on lock cutting. General consensus was that this would be criminal damage but the Police/CPS would be very unlikely to pursue the matter.
Previous thread on lock cutting. General consensus was that this would be criminal damage but the Police/CPS would be very unlikely to pursue the matter.
High on a cocktail of flossy teacakes and marmalade
Re: cycle Lockers -display of use of terms and condition
I'm still puzzling over what your problem is. I think I get it.
I guess you're short of storage space where you live, which is near some of those lockers, so you want to store a bike (and maybe other stuff too) in a locker for most of the time. So you'll not be using it for day commuting as intended, but neither will you be leaving it empty.
I guess you're short of storage space where you live, which is near some of those lockers, so you want to store a bike (and maybe other stuff too) in a locker for most of the time. So you'll not be using it for day commuting as intended, but neither will you be leaving it empty.
Chris Juden
One lady owner, never raced or jumped.
One lady owner, never raced or jumped.
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dave holladay
- Posts: 284
- Joined: 4 Apr 2007, 12:25pm
Re: cycle Lockers -display of use of terms and condition
Looks like the equivalent of an RTFM fault here.
Locks which are securing the door on a locker which does not have a bike in it are presumably 'reserving' that locker for a person who may only use the locker on weekdays or even fewer times in a week.
Read that way the statement is a clear notice of intent which is badly worded - it should make it clear that a lock which secures an empty locker may be cut or otherwise removed and that no claim from the lock will be entertained due to the clearly stated condition that locks on unoccupied lockers may be cut or otherwise removed.
Lockers which are 'managed' in this way are not very effectively managed and for many places lockers offer a poor solution They are costly, make poor use of space, don't give the users a reliable option of finding an available space, unless a sophisticated booking regime is in place, or very inefficiently individuals rent individual lockers. There are even folk still naievely leaving open lockers for own lock use and then get surprised when the lockers get used for purposes other than storing a bike....
Locks which are securing the door on a locker which does not have a bike in it are presumably 'reserving' that locker for a person who may only use the locker on weekdays or even fewer times in a week.
Read that way the statement is a clear notice of intent which is badly worded - it should make it clear that a lock which secures an empty locker may be cut or otherwise removed and that no claim from the lock will be entertained due to the clearly stated condition that locks on unoccupied lockers may be cut or otherwise removed.
Lockers which are 'managed' in this way are not very effectively managed and for many places lockers offer a poor solution They are costly, make poor use of space, don't give the users a reliable option of finding an available space, unless a sophisticated booking regime is in place, or very inefficiently individuals rent individual lockers. There are even folk still naievely leaving open lockers for own lock use and then get surprised when the lockers get used for purposes other than storing a bike....
Re: cycle Lockers -display of use of terms and condition
Durham seems even less well organised: http://road.cc/content/news/46358-bike- ... devise-way
Re: cycle Lockers -display of use of terms and condition
As I want to keep my property I've removed the bike and will not longer be using the locker in case I come along one day and the padlocks and the property gone.
The way in which the council seem to expect these lockers to be used does not tally with the Terms and Conditions detailed on display. The lockers are a smashing idea - its just the actual way they work in practice that does not seem to give a semblance of matching the security and protection which a multi story car park does for a car.
Ironically enough if they did display the ( assumed ) T and C then more pressure on the council and hopefully more provision would be the result,
Toby
The way in which the council seem to expect these lockers to be used does not tally with the Terms and Conditions detailed on display. The lockers are a smashing idea - its just the actual way they work in practice that does not seem to give a semblance of matching the security and protection which a multi story car park does for a car.
Ironically enough if they did display the ( assumed ) T and C then more pressure on the council and hopefully more provision would be the result,
Toby
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thirdcrank
- Posts: 36778
- Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 2:44pm
Re: cycle Lockers -display of use of terms and condition
QUIST
I don't really know anything about civil law other than to advise people to get proper legal advice, which is why I didn't post before. OTOH, the way you have posted this has left me confused. From your OP, I presumed you were in dispute with the authority over something factual about your use of the locker, and that you were waiting for their evidence which seemed to be contentious. If they are wrongly alleging that you did something which you did not do, then the terms and conditions seem irrelevant. If you are accurately quoting the words they have used, then it's impossible to remove property from an empty locker.
In a later post you seem to be simultaneously saying this is a "what if" but also that it's already happened. That's in the context of your apparent acceptance of the authority's implied intention that the lockers should be used by commuters etc who would normally remove their property the same day, while your own requirement seems to be for longer term secure storage.
I don't really know anything about civil law other than to advise people to get proper legal advice, which is why I didn't post before. OTOH, the way you have posted this has left me confused. From your OP, I presumed you were in dispute with the authority over something factual about your use of the locker, and that you were waiting for their evidence which seemed to be contentious. If they are wrongly alleging that you did something which you did not do, then the terms and conditions seem irrelevant. If you are accurately quoting the words they have used, then it's impossible to remove property from an empty locker.
In a later post you seem to be simultaneously saying this is a "what if" but also that it's already happened. That's in the context of your apparent acceptance of the authority's implied intention that the lockers should be used by commuters etc who would normally remove their property the same day, while your own requirement seems to be for longer term secure storage.