How central must front lamp be?

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SA_SA_SA
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How central must front lamp be?

Post by SA_SA_SA »

The legal position is on the CTC lighting page http://www.ctc.org.uk/cyclists-library/regulations/lighting-regulations: follow the links to the law and notice the bit about centre-line or off-side. Lots of riders have lights fixed just left of the stem. How far left of the stem is failing to meet the requirement?

If the answer is zero, then I suggest at the next update to lighting regulations they are updated to say a sole front lamp should be centrally mounted, then specify how far left/right(offside) of the stem is acceptable ( I am presuming it would be allowed slightly more latitude on the offside).

But mounting a sole approved lamp just to the left should be acceptable IMO...
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maxcherry
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by maxcherry »

Does it matter as long as the light is on the front and attached?
Most lights I have seen are not that visible any way and the police are
not going to pull over cyclist and measure the distance if they are not
even concerned about how visible the light is (that's if they have a light)
Honestly chaps, I'm a female!
beardy
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by beardy »

If you think back to the reason for having this condition, it doesnt matter how far you are from the centre line, it matters how far your light is from the right handside of the bike.
Then if it isnt central it has the possibility of being shielded by the bike itself, if say positioned on the left hand fork.

A similar rule to that imposed on cars may make sense "No further than Xcm from the right handside of the vehicle" Though motorcycles are normally much wider than cycles and can also have only the central light fitted.

The rule was probably established with a recognition that there are only so many good places to mount a light on a bike, and written to prevent us sticking them on the wrong side.
I for one always mount my light just left of centre, I find it more natural with the buttons and dont see anybody interpreting the law so strictly that it is no longer considered central.
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andrew_s
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by andrew_s »

Should push ever come to shove, judges will apply a "reasonable" interpretation of the wording.
On the middle of the handlebars close* to the stem on either side will be OK, on the nearside fork blade or seatstay won't be.

* where "close" is inboard of all grips, brakes or shifters
broadway
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by broadway »

beardy wrote:The rule was probably established with a recognition that there are only so many good places to mount a light on a bike, and written to prevent us sticking them on the wrong side.
I for one always mount my light just left of centre, I find it more natural with the buttons and dont see anybody interpreting the law so strictly that it is no longer considered central.


The o/s rule probably dates back to when fork and stay mounted light fittings were common.
Bicycler
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by Bicycler »

Definitely. The "central" position in mind was almost certainly the fork crown (and rear racks/mudguards). Handlebar mounted lights probably weren't given much thought
axel_knutt
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by axel_knutt »

beardy wrote:Then if it isnt central it has the possibility of being shielded by the bike itself, if say positioned on the left hand fork.


I had my lamp mounted on the right fork leg, but I decided to move it up top after I was knocked off by a car pulling out of a road on the left.
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markfh
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by markfh »

Perhaps another way of looking at this is to consider the possible reasoning behind requirement. One purpose of the front light is to help other road users know where you are and help them make a judgement as to whether there is enough room between the oncoming vehicle (bicycle in this case) and their side of the road to proceed. If the light is mounted too far to the left, then they will think the gap is wider than it is. Clearly a couple of inches (5 cm) from the centre line will not make a lot of difference - if the "driver" of the oncoming vehicle is trying to judge things to that sort of level then their vehicle is probably going to pass far to !*?%?*! close. I am sure most road users have had the disconcerting experience of seeing a single headlight approaching and then finding out, hopefully before it is too late, that it is actually a car with a failed offside (driver side) headlight.
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barrym
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by barrym »

markfh wrote: I am sure most road users have had the disconcerting experience of seeing a single headlight approaching and then finding out, hopefully before it is too late, that it is actually a car with a failed offside (driver side) headlight.


Off topic, but I remember some years ago, I was driving home from work on as wry dark night along a derestricted road that I knew well. I saw a pair of headlights on main beam. I flashed to get them dipped. Nothing. As I approached, arguably too fast, I knew I had to pass with the lights to my right. As I got closer I seemed to be running out of road. At the last moment I realised that this car was parked on the wrong side of the road!!!

That was the nearest I came to needing a change of underwear whilst driving.

Barry
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thirdcrank
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by thirdcrank »

barrym wrote: ...Off topic, ....


But not very far.

Your experience seems to be a good example of why there are all these apparently pointless lighting regs. In your case, the driver was apparently committing offences of parking on the wrong side of the road at night, and parking at night with the headlights on. (My wording.) What's needed is some jobsworths to enforce them.
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barrym
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by barrym »

thirdcrank wrote:
barrym wrote: ...Off topic, ....


But not very far.

Your experience seems to be a good example of why there are all these apparently pointless lighting regs. In your case, the driver was apparently committing offences of parking on the wrong side of the road at night, and parking at night with the headlights on. (My wording.) What's needed is some jobsworths to enforce them.


Well I nearly 'enforced' putting out the lights!
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Bicycler
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by Bicycler »

markfh wrote:Perhaps another way of looking at this is to consider the possible reasoning behind requirement. One purpose of the front light is to help other road users know where you are and help them make a judgement as to whether there is enough room between the oncoming vehicle (bicycle in this case) and their side of the road to proceed. If the light is mounted too far to the left, then they will think the gap is wider than it is.

That is certainly my logic in mounting my lights as far right as possible (bars and seat stay though I also have central rear light). Every little helps!
SleepyJoe
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by SleepyJoe »

Ah, but..
Mounting a light on the right makes sense if you want to be seen by other road users as it is then less likely to be obscured by your forks (assuming it is mounted at low level)
However, it doesn't help if someone is trying to pull out of a side right on your left up ahead.
In addition, the shadow cast by your forks also neatly obscures all the potholes, drains and kerb edges.
So it depends- do you want to be seen by most other road users or do you want to see the edge of the road?

Personally I have my main non-flashing light mounted centrally(ish) on the handlebars and a couple of blinkies mounted at different heights on the RHS.
I don't think any of them are legal, but I have never been stopped by the police and I don't think they will bother as long as I am visible & lit up.

Mark
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RickH
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by RickH »

My main light is mounted on the bars approx 4cm to the left of centre - basically as near to the stem clamp as possible.

It is on the left rather than the right as I hang the light (Exposure Toro, with remote switch) under the bars as above the bars competes for space with my stem mounted computer and on the left as mounted under the front brake cable gets in the way. I used to have it right of centre when the lamp was mounted on a Minoura SwingGrip along with a mini map holder (actually used for route sheets) but I took it off as I haven't used the map holder for a couple of years.

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The fat commuter
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Re: How central must front lamp be?

Post by The fat commuter »

My legal headlight is just to the left of centre. My other light that I use on flash is just to the right of centre. I suppose that really they should be swapped around.


barrym wrote:Off topic, but I remember some years ago, I was driving home from work on as wry dark night along a derestricted road that I knew well. I saw a pair of headlights on main beam. I flashed to get them dipped. Nothing. As I approached, arguably too fast, I knew I had to pass with the lights to my right. As I got closer I seemed to be running out of road. At the last moment I realised that this car was parked on the wrong side of the road!!!

That was the nearest I came to needing a change of underwear whilst driving.

Barry


Reminds me of many years ago driving home (when I lived there) from Newcastle to Carlisle late at night on the A69 just past Haltwhistle. Near here https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.96612 ... tydTmA!2e0

I was driving in my usual style for my age. Noticed two sets of headlights coming towards me side by side. Assumed that the left hand set of lights would pull in front of the other set, but this didn't seen to be happening. Realised that both sets of lights were going to stay side by side so hammered on the brakes. Actually came to a stop when both sets of lights went past on my right. It wasn't one car overtaking another, one set was from a car, the second set was a train.

Sorry, completely off topic.
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