Battery versus Dynamo

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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by [XAP]Bob »

If you have a rack then you should be able to mount a rack mounted (50 or 80mm bolt hole) lamp to that rather than the bike frame.

Go German (or dutch) - they actually treat these things as sensible, and useful, additions.
I started with lamps and a bottle and rapidly went to a hub. With a new dynamo wheel coming in at about your budget you may well want to think about "resale budget" i.e. how much are you willing to pay to test this out?

If you buy a wheel for £50-£70, but decide to sell it in 6 months you'll get most of that money back
Similarly the lights - you'll get money back from reselling the lights (here if needed)

Of course if your limit is cash flow then this doesn't help...
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edocaster
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by edocaster »

mjr wrote:[*] http://www.bike-discount.de/shop/k342/lights.html - Axa HR + Axa Pico 30 T Steady Auto LED headlight + Axa Ray Steady LED which I think works out about £45 after delivery and conversion.[/list]

Are there others that you would suggest?


As a recent dynamo convert, and a user of the Pico, I'd say it's bright enough. Could be brighter, but I guess I'm spoiled by Cree battery LEDs. Feature-wise, there are a few gotchas though - as far as I can tell, no version has a switch which can disable the standlight, and all switched versions have no more than two positions (as an aside - why do dynamo headlights come in so many different versions? Surely this is hugely inefficient in terms of economies of scale, and leads to much surplus stock? I'm sure every version of the Pico cost no more than about £9 to produce...). But I'm quite happy that it gives all the main benefits of modern dynamo lighting, for relatively little money.

If you're already willing to pay up to £20 for a bottle dynamo, an alternative would be to look out for dynamo wheels on eBay for a little more. As long as they're not shot bearing or electrical-wise, you may find a bargain.
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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by [XAP]Bob »

Yep, second hand hub dynamos appear here as well....

Standlight, sensing, braketec, on/off road.

All the options that make stuff useful. I'd suggest that a standlight should be a given. The sensor and beam pattern are good options.

wrt scale, the lights are mostly the same, it's just a case of not adding certain circuit elements.
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
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mjr
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by mjr »

I'm not finding good second hand hub dynamo wheels with lights within the £50ish budget here, ebay or Gumtree. Where are you?

Even the £70 wheels I've seen contain hub dynamos that are slated by people on this forum and I'd like to give dynamos a fair crack. Resale is time consuming too.

I'd probably use a cheaper known-brand dynamo than the €15ish Axa HR and use the money saved on a more reviewed headlight but the extra delivery charge of ordering from two shops would wipe out any saving.
Last edited by mjr on 18 Oct 2013, 9:54am, edited 1 time in total.
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meic
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by meic »

http://www.rosebikes.co.uk/article/atb- ... aid:581967

Two pounds 64p over your £70 if you include postage. I dont think that anybody has slated the 3N80 on this forum.
Not much use to you if you are using 26" or narrow tyres.

You could have a look at their lights too if paying the postage already.
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Brucey
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by Brucey »

the DH-3N80 is reportedly a good unit. The only flaw might be that it has aluminium windings, which means that servicing the RH bearing is trickier than with copper windings; the latter can take a little more bending and are easier to repair by soldering. However since there are very few instances of 3N80s eating their bearings (maybe they have improved the seals...?) despite years of use, maybe this isn't a big deal.

cheers
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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
edocaster
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by edocaster »

mjr wrote:I'm not finding good second hand hub dynamo wheels with lights within the £50ish budget here, ebay or Gumtree. Where are you?

Even the £70 wheels I've seen contain hub dynamos that are slated by people on this forum and I'd like to give dynamos a fair crack. Resale is time consuming too.

I'd probably use a cheaper known-brand dynamo than the €15ish Axa HR and use the money saved on a more reviewed headlight but the extra delivery charge of ordering from two shops would wipe out any saving.


This is actually about as high-end as you can go, I believe: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/171149364552 - will probably go for a much higher bid than it is at now, but if you keep a lookout you can probably get a decent wheel for less than half of what this one goes for.
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mjr
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by mjr »

Yeah thanks but that's already at £45 so the whole budget on its own and gambling on resale if the trial fails. Other hub dynamos currently on there seem to be the 3n20 or 3n30 in the same price range. I could watch and wait but if we don't try this soon, we'll be partway through winter and battery costs and so on anyway. I think the hub will have to wait for a later upgrade if the trial succeeds.

I'm leaning towards an Axa set from Germany, based on comments above. I'm going to see if Spanish shops are any good as I could get stuff from there faster maybe this week but I think it is telling that UK stores put lights under accessories while German and Dutch sites put them under components.
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MikeF
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by MikeF »

mjr wrote:.... I think it is telling that UK stores put lights under accessories while German and Dutch sites put them under components.
That's because much of what is sold in the UK as lights is "bling" :lol: or else "lumen marketing". Much more effort and thought has been put into the design of cycle lights from Germany and Holland eg beam shaping so that it doesn't dazzle, but gives illumination where it's needed. It's a pity that German law was necessary to play such a big effect in cycle lighting.
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pete75
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by pete75 »

mjr wrote:
Even the £70 wheels I've seen contain hub dynamos that are slated by people on this forum and I'd like to give dynamos a fair crack. Resale is time consuming too.



If you won't buy a cycle component that has been slated here you'd never buy any at all. :(

A lot of adverse comments are based on supposition or brand prejudice. The ones worth listening to are from people who've owned and used a particular item for a reasonable period of time and miles travelled.
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mjr
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by mjr »

pete75 wrote:If you won't buy a cycle component that has been slated here you'd never buy any at all. :(

A lot of adverse comments are based on supposition or brand prejudice. The ones worth listening to are from people who've owned and used a particular item for a reasonable period of time and miles travelled.

I don't think it's brand prejudice. For two examples, I found mainly nice words about the Axa bits I was considering, whereas I saw the Shimano DH-3N20 and 3N30 often criticised by people who also praise the 3N80. I'm also aware that brands change over time, or between product types: Specialized tyres and tubes are my example of something that I used to like but recently hasn't been very good for me, although I still like some other ranges from them.

If one only considered comments "from people who've owned and used a particular item for a reasonable period of time and miles" then that's far more likely to include only people who are happy with a bit of kit, else they would have stopped or switched to something else, wouldn't they?

Anyway, the order for Axa Pico and Riff lights has gone in - I changed my mind after reading reviews on other websites of the Ray and Riff and deciding I'd prefer a red bar to a blob. Thanks to everyone who's contributed helpful comments to this discussion.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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kwackers
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by kwackers »

mjr wrote:If one only considered comments "from people who've owned and used a particular item for a reasonable period of time and miles" then that's far more likely to include only people who are happy with a bit of kit, else they would have stopped or switched to something else, wouldn't they?

Human nature being what it is people are far more likely to post about stuff they're unhappy with. Happy people are silent people and the bane of a lot of product manufacturers.

(For the record I'm very happy with my Son dynamo and B&M lights, although for what they'd cost you'd hope so...)
pete75
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by pete75 »

mjr wrote:
pete75 wrote:If you won't buy a cycle component that has been slated here you'd never buy any at all. :(

A lot of adverse comments are based on supposition or brand prejudice. The ones worth listening to are from people who've owned and used a particular item for a reasonable period of time and miles travelled.

I don't think it's brand prejudice. For two examples, I found mainly nice words about the Axa bits I was considering, whereas I saw the Shimano DH-3N20 and 3N30 often criticised by people who also praise the 3N80. I'm also aware that brands change over time, or between product types: Specialized tyres and tubes are my example of something that I used to like but recently hasn't been very good for me, although I still like some other ranges from them.

If one only considered comments "from people who've owned and used a particular item for a reasonable period of time and miles" then that's far more likely to include only people who are happy with a bit of kit, else they would have stopped or switched to something else, wouldn't they?

Anyway, the order for Axa Pico and Riff lights has gone in - I changed my mind after reading reviews on other websites of the Ray and Riff and deciding I'd prefer a red bar to a blob. Thanks to everyone who's contributed helpful comments to this discussion.



If someone has used an item long enough for it develop a fault then I'd say that's a reasonable enough period for their views to be worth listening to.

From my own point of view there's not much wrong with Shimano N72 hubs or Axa Traction Hr and B&M dymotec bottle dynamos. I've used all 3 for long and fault free periods.

BTW if this report is anything to go by the N30 offers reasonable value for money particularly for a not too high mileage rider.
http://www.bikequarterly.com/VBQgenerator.pdf
Last edited by pete75 on 21 Oct 2013, 5:09pm, edited 1 time in total.
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mig
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by mig »

on the subject of mileage on generator hubs i take it that most users use a different front wheel for the 'summer' months?
robc02
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Re: Battery versus Dynamo

Post by robc02 »

mig wrote:on the subject of mileage on generator hubs i take it that most users use a different front wheel for the 'summer' months?


I do on my main commuter bike. I also have a roadster, used for a lot of short local journeys, that has its dynamo on all year round (and the lights as there isn't a switch).
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