B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

For discussions about bikes and equipment.

B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby Andy_M » Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:29 pm

In the instructions to my B&M IQ Cyo headlight it very casually mentions that the light can be used with a battery, without really going into details. Has anyone done this? Like a bit of info on best battery options, run time etc....
Andy_M
 
Posts: 110
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2008 11:43 pm
Location: Warrington

Re: B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby Phil_Lee » Wed Mar 31, 2010 7:01 pm

You're going to need to effectively simulate the output from a dynamo, so something with at least 4v and not more than about 8v should be ok.
Current delivery needs to be at least 0.5A (500mA), but this is less of a concern than the capacity (anything that lasts more than a couple of hours should be able to deliver half an amp).

If you have the 40 lux version, the same emitter and optics are used on the Ixon IQ, which uses 4xAA NiMH, I'd think that would be a good starting point, although you may get slightly higher output with 5xAA, since this would give 6v instead of 4.8v.
In the Ixon IQ, you get 5 hours on "high" from 4x2100mAh NiMh AA cells.
The 60 lux Cyo may need lightly more juice (or it may be a later and more efficient LED).

If B&M say the Cyo can be used with batteries, it should be safe to assume that the light can handle for itself the fact that bicycle dynamos are AC and the batteries DC (the LED is DC anyway).

I have an Ixon IQ, which can give the best of both worlds - it's charging socket can be driven by the Ride & Charge adapter from a dynamo, or it can run on AA cells, and if you fit both, the AA cells will be recharged by the dynamo (but only very slowly if you are running the light as well) :)
I suspect this may make the Ixon IQ and Ride & Charge the perfect touring combination.

Hope that helps, but test things carefully as you go - this advice is probably worth exactly what you paid for it :)
User avatar
Phil_Lee
 
Posts: 726
Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:41 am
Location: Cambs

Re: B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby rualexander » Wed Mar 31, 2010 7:09 pm

Phil_Lee wrote:I have an Ixon IQ, which can give the best of both worlds - it's charging socket can be driven by the Ride & Charge adapter from a dynamo, or it can run on AA cells, and if you fit both, the AA cells will be recharged by the dynamo (but only very slowly if you are running the light as well) :)
I suspect this may make the Ixon IQ and Ride & Charge the perfect touring combination.

Hope that helps, but test things carefully as you go - this advice is probably worth exactly what you paid for it :)

Phil,
This is what I have been considering, I already have the Ixon IQ and I am thinking of getting a hub dynamo and the Ride & Charge unit to give me AA charging ability while touring. Have you done this in practice and what is your opinion? Also does the Ixon IQ run as a dynamo light when connected to the charging system even if there are no batteries in the light?
rualexander
 
Posts: 1706
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2007 9:47 pm

Re: B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby Phil_Lee » Wed Mar 31, 2010 10:31 pm

rualexander wrote:
Phil_Lee wrote:I have an Ixon IQ, which can give the best of both worlds - it's charging socket can be driven by the Ride & Charge adapter from a dynamo, or it can run on AA cells, and if you fit both, the AA cells will be recharged by the dynamo (but only very slowly if you are running the light as well) :)
I suspect this may make the Ixon IQ and Ride & Charge the perfect touring combination.

Hope that helps, but test things carefully as you go - this advice is probably worth exactly what you paid for it :)

Phil,
This is what I have been considering, I already have the Ixon IQ and I am thinking of getting a hub dynamo and the Ride & Charge unit to give me AA charging ability while touring. Have you done this in practice and what is your opinion? Also does the Ixon IQ run as a dynamo light when connected to the charging system even if there are no batteries in the light?


I haven't tried it yet - I've just read the same B&M documents that you undoubtedly have :)

I brief experiment with my Ixon and it's mains charger confirms that it will not run without cells installed :(

The use of the light (on full power) while connected should be fine to prevent overcharging, so if you aren't using a conventional dynamo light as well you could dispense with the trailermatic connection.
User avatar
Phil_Lee
 
Posts: 726
Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:41 am
Location: Cambs

Re: B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby andrew_s » Thu Apr 01, 2010 7:19 pm

From what I remember seeing, battery power is OK for a Cyo, subject to a 7.5V limit
andrew_s
 
Posts: 2826
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2007 9:29 pm
Location: Gloucestershire

Re: B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby RJC » Fri Apr 02, 2010 9:16 pm

Does it say anything about the voltage range or polarity?
For the B&M led dynamo light one generation previous to CYO I think it only worked
with the batteries one way round despite the fact that a dynamo is an AC source.
I was told by B&M that maximum brightness is reached with 7.5V DC but it wasn't advisable to go beyond that.
RJC
 
Posts: 126
Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 7:17 pm

Re: B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby Phil_Lee » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:24 am

RJC wrote:Does it say anything about the voltage range or polarity?
For the B&M led dynamo light one generation previous to CYO I think it only worked
with the batteries one way round despite the fact that a dynamo is an AC source.
I was told by B&M that maximum brightness is reached with 7.5V DC but it wasn't advisable to go beyond that.


If the batteries only work one way round it would indicate that they are not using a full bridge rectifier, which strikes me as strange, as I'd understood that the blocking capability of the led was insufficient on it's own, so you need some kind of additional diode anyway - using 3 more wouldn't increase the cost much, but would double the available power.
And why throw away half of what is already a limited power supply?
Could it be something to do with standlight capacitor charging or something like that? If so, it wouldn't matter if it was running on battery anyway.
I guess that's something that testing would resolve.

6 x NiMh cells would give 7.2v (absolute maximum 7.5 straight off the charger), and 6 cell AA, C, or even D holders are readily available at maplins or similar.
A pair of Lithium Ion cells would give a similar voltage at lower weight and higher cost, but chargers would be more expensive too, and there are some safety considerations with them - but they can be charged very fast.
I'd go for NiMh AAs, and pack spares if more capacity were needed, and maybe a dummy cell to allow the use of 5xAA alkalines (=7.5v) in an emergency.

P.S. mind your eyes with the testing - you don't want those high power LEDs directed into your eyes at close range.
User avatar
Phil_Lee
 
Posts: 726
Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:41 am
Location: Cambs

Re: B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby simonineaston » Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:32 pm

I'm a bit hazy about this topic, folks - can you firm it up for me a bit? I'll tell you where I'm coming from and then you can tell me if this sounds sensible...
What I've got:
1 X SatMap Active 10 (eats AA cells for breakfast... Li-thingy battery a possibility)
What I haven't got:
1 X hub dynamo
1 X unspecifed front lamp...
What I'd like:
some sort of sytem, based on a hub dynamo, that charges a spare set of 3 AA cells to replace the 3 that the Active 10 will use up during Day 2 of any tour. On Day 2, the 3 cells would be swapped, and so-on until the last day of any tour. In the meantime, having installed a hub dynamo, it would make sense to additionally install an LED-based front lamp. Could the hub dynamo re-charge the Li-thingy battery?
Am I in cloud-cuckoo land?
ttfn, Simon in Easton
(currently enjoying Moulton F frames & a Brompton...)
User avatar
simonineaston
 
Posts: 1247
Joined: Wed May 09, 2007 1:06 pm
Location: Bristol - work in ...Yate!

Re: B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby sbseven » Thu Apr 22, 2010 8:06 pm

simonineaston wrote:What I'd like:
some sort of sytem, based on a hub dynamo, that charges a spare set of 3 AA cells to replace the 3 that the Active 10 will use up during Day 2 of any tour. On Day 2, the 3 cells would be swapped, and so-on until the last day of any tour. In the meantime, having installed a hub dynamo, it would make sense to additionally install an LED-based front lamp. Could the hub dynamo re-charge the Li-thingy battery?
Am I in cloud-cuckoo land?

Re: The hub dynamo recharging part
Yes it can be done, but it's not going to be cheap buying the commerical products. Try: PedalPower+ Universal-i-Cable for AC Hub Dynamo (£60) or Busch & Muller E-Werk (£120). Both these products provide 5V DC-OUT from a AC Dynamo (Schmidt SON/Shimano etc.). (The E-werk also provides other voltages as well). These will charge any simple USB style AA battery recharger (and iPods/phones etc.) straight from the dynamo hub. You can also get a lithium battery, one that charges from a 5V DC-IN (i.e. can be charged by the above products) and supplies a USB style 5V DC-OUT to charge batteries, iPods, phones etc. away from the bike. E.g. iWalk3600 (£30) or iWalk6400 (£50).

(OT. Might be better in it's own thread...)

Shaun
sbseven
 
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2010 12:51 am

Re: B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby rualexander » Thu Apr 22, 2010 8:39 pm

simonineaston,
The B&M Ixon IQ system as mentioned above should be capable of doing what you are looking for. The Ixon IQ light takes four AA rechargeables to use it as a light (a very good one), if you have a dynamo and the B&M Ride & Charge unit you can charge the AA batteries in the Ixon IQ while riding. So with a couple of sets of batteries you should be able to rotate them from your Satmap device to the Ixon for charging and back into the Satmap.
rualexander
 
Posts: 1706
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2007 9:47 pm

Re: B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby simonineaston » Fri Apr 23, 2010 11:01 am

sbseven wrote: ...or Busch & Muller E-Werk (£120).

Blimey - not withstanding its excellent design & Eurobike award, that's some price for a plastic box surrounding a pcb...
ttfn, Simon in Easton
(currently enjoying Moulton F frames & a Brompton...)
User avatar
simonineaston
 
Posts: 1247
Joined: Wed May 09, 2007 1:06 pm
Location: Bristol - work in ...Yate!

Re: B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby syklist » Sun Apr 25, 2010 4:43 pm

rualexander wrote:
Phil_Lee wrote:I have an Ixon IQ, which can give the best of both worlds - it's charging socket can be driven by the Ride & Charge adapter from a dynamo, or it can run on AA cells, and if you fit both, the AA cells will be recharged by the dynamo (but only very slowly if you are running the light as well) :)
I suspect this may make the Ixon IQ and Ride & Charge the perfect touring combination.

Hope that helps, but test things carefully as you go - this advice is probably worth exactly what you paid for it :)

Phil,
This is what I have been considering, I already have the Ixon IQ and I am thinking of getting a hub dynamo and the Ride & Charge unit to give me AA charging ability while touring. Have you done this in practice and what is your opinion? Also does the Ixon IQ run as a dynamo light when connected to the charging system even if there are no batteries in the light?

I have done this and it works quite well for charging AA batteries. Charging is dependent on average (modal) speed and not distance travelled. In the flat coastal terrain of Germany and Denmark I was charging a set of AA batteries in 5-6 hours of cycling, a normal cycling day for me on tour. However in hilly Norway it could take up to three cycling days to charge batteries. In flat terrain I spend a lot of time in the 16-20km/h range whilst in Norway I can spend a few hours a day in the 5-8km/h range.

I modified the Ride and Charge cable with a two pole switch mounted in a waterproof housing on the handlebars. This allows me to switch power to the dynamo lights instead of charging the IXON IQ, which is particularly useful whilst navigating a tunnel as it doubles front light output. Or I can choose to turn on the dynamo lights on the move if visibility is poor.

On a longer tour I take a separate fast charger with me just to make sure we don't run out of fully charged AA batteries. If I only had one camera with me then the IXON IQ/Ride and Charge would keep me in charged batteries but it isn't good enough to keep three cameras and a gps unit supplied with fresh batteries in hilly areas.
HTH
Stan
User avatar
syklist
 
Posts: 378
Joined: Mon May 19, 2008 6:43 pm
Location: Gol in Buskerud, Norway

Re: B&M IQ Cyo with a Battery

Postby Phil_Lee » Sun Apr 25, 2010 11:50 pm

syklist wrote:I have done this and it works quite well for charging AA batteries. Charging is dependent on average (modal) speed and not distance travelled. In the flat coastal terrain of Germany and Denmark I was charging a set of AA batteries in 5-6 hours of cycling, a normal cycling day for me on tour. However in hilly Norway it could take up to three cycling days to charge batteries. In flat terrain I spend a lot of time in the 16-20km/h range whilst in Norway I can spend a few hours a day in the 5-8km/h range.

I modified the Ride and Charge cable with a two pole switch mounted in a waterproof housing on the handlebars. This allows me to switch power to the dynamo lights instead of charging the IXON IQ, which is particularly useful whilst navigating a tunnel as it doubles front light output. Or I can choose to turn on the dynamo lights on the move if visibility is poor.

On a longer tour I take a separate fast charger with me just to make sure we don't run out of fully charged AA batteries. If I only had one camera with me then the IXON IQ/Ride and Charge would keep me in charged batteries but it isn't good enough to keep three cameras and a gps unit supplied with fresh batteries in hilly areas.
HTH
Stan


That sounds much like the setup I'm considering.
If an offroad style beam were used on the straight dynamo light (i.e. one with no cutoff on the beam), the use of the switch would give a high beam /dipped beam functionality, with the Ixon running full-time (and being charged when full beam is off) and the high beam only being added when the unshaded dynamo lamp is switched on.

The problem may be in finding a powerful dynamo lamp that isn't designed to cut the beam off "dipped beam" style.
Normally, a beam like that would be rather antisocial, but if it's only used as a "high beam", it would be fine (and could be a great encouragement for motorists to dip their headlights).
User avatar
Phil_Lee
 
Posts: 726
Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:41 am
Location: Cambs


Return to Bikes & Bits – Technical section

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: freeloader, hodge and 6 guests