front wheel movement

[martinn]

Hi All,

how much "give/ flex" is your front wheel supposed to do?

When cycling out of the saddle, as I rock the bike from side to side, I can hear the rims rubbing against the brake blocks, is this normal? and if not what should I look at to see what the problem is?
Does not rub normally and appears to my eye at least to be perfectly "True"

Wheel is tightly clasped in the drop outs, I weigh about 84Kg, with carbon forks and the front wheel is Mavis Ksyrium Elite S (2014 model) with 25mm GP4000 II tyres.

Many thanks
Martin

[pwa]

Are the bearings okay? To check, try rocking the top of the wheel left and right near the brake. You should get very little easy movement if all is well.

[barrym]

Check spoke tension. Ping them all and check for any dull sounding ones.

[Brucey]

I would expect that wheel (like very many that 'don't have enough spokes in') to flex when you ride out of the saddle; you may find you need about 1.5 to 2mm brake clearance each side to allow for this.

If it hasn't always been like that then something has changed; spoke gone slack or fork on the way out or something.... so inspect everything carefully.

cheers

[Mick F]

It may not be the wheel. It could be the front fork.

[NUKe]

Hi All,

how much "give/ flex" is your front wheel supposed to do?

When cycling out of the saddle, as I rock the bike from side to side, I can hear the rims rubbing against the brake blocks, is this normal? and if not what should I look at to see what the problem is?
Does not rub normally and appears to my eye at least to be perfectly "True"

Wheel is tightly clasped in the drop outs, I weigh about 84Kg, with carbon forks and the front wheel is Mavis Ksyrium Elite S (2014 model) with 25mm GP4000 II tyres.

Many thanks
Martin

your too heavy, a bit like me , with too few spokes. I remedid the same problem by changing to a 36 spoke wheel althoough a 32 would have done. Alternatively loosen the brake slightly as Brucey suggested.

NUKe

[MikeF]

Great for training or racing, these wheels are more than capable of taking the stress and strain you'll put them through.

There you have it! You could claim??

[martinn]

Spoke to the chap at the not lbs, but trusted and recommended bike shop! He said that essentially I am too heavy, wheels are set up fine. I have also noticed I can get the rear wheel to flex, so again when the brakes are set as recommended, the wheel rubs.
Currently I have both sets of brakes with about 3 mm of clearance each side.
So as we spoke about wheels, unfortunately in front of my wife who now know the price for certain wheels, we talked round the types available.
So question, would a set of carbon wheels be suitable. I have looked at the fast forward, they are designed for for riders 100kg.
Do people use these wheels all year round and for commuting or just for racing?
And would I notice the difference? I do like climbing hills,
Many thanks
Martin

[mattsccm]

Fairly conventional thinking suggests that light wheels are nicer for climbing. However how much will you notice it? Carbon wheels are not always the lightest and anyway you have proved that light isn't the way to go. Light means fragile, or relatively so.
Why not have a word with a couple of the well known wheel builders, giving them all the info you can.

[pwa]

Pick the phone up and talk to Paul Hewitt, who has supplied wheels to Wiggins. He is a no-nonsense bloke who will not try to sell you something that is more expensive than you need. And his own hand built wheels (if that is what he recommends) are about the £300 mark for a pair. He built me a pair within a week of ordering.

[Brucey]

Spoke to the chap at the not lbs, but trusted and recommended bike shop! He said that essentially I am too heavy, wheels are set up fine. I have also noticed I can get the rear wheel to flex, so again when the brakes are set as recommended, the wheel rubs.
Currently I have both sets of brakes with about 3 mm of clearance each side.
So as we spoke about wheels, unfortunately in front of my wife who now know the price for certain wheels, we talked round the types available.
So question, would a set of carbon wheels be suitable. I have looked at the fast forward, they are designed for for riders 100kg.
Do people use these wheels all year round and for commuting or just for racing?
And would I notice the difference? I do like climbing hills,
Many thanks
Martin

these days I'm heavy so I probably couldn't ride those wheels without similar troubles. But when I was lighter I was still strong and I couldn't ride those kinds of wheels then either. Everything that could flex, flexed, and everything that could rub, rubbed.

IMHO the design of the wheels you have at present owes more to fashion than it does engineering.

Honestly, if you want a decent set of wheels for zooming around on the weekend ask yourself why not something like

- 32 x3 DB spokes
- Mavic Open Pro rims
- decent hubs

If you want to go belt and braces choose a 36h rear wheel; this will 'cost' about 30g, and no, you won't notice the difference. Such wheels won't be heavy, they will ride really well, and should last well if they are built properly. When the rims wear out or get bent you can have them rebuilt.

You mention commuting too; what makes you think that a set of flim-flam wheels that are (say) barely adequate for a 65kg bloke to race on a few times a year might have any chance of surviving in commuting duties? In the event of damage, how would you ever repair them? Truly, what are your priorities?

Note that simply because they won't be moving around all the time you will probably be faster on a set of open pros than on the rather flexy wheels you've been riding round on.

cheers

[pwa]

Spoke to the chap at the not lbs, but trusted and recommended bike shop! He said that essentially I am too heavy, wheels are set up fine. I have also noticed I can get the rear wheel to flex, so again when the brakes are set as recommended, the wheel rubs.
Currently I have both sets of brakes with about 3 mm of clearance each side.
So as we spoke about wheels, unfortunately in front of my wife who now know the price for certain wheels, we talked round the types available.
So question, would a set of carbon wheels be suitable. I have looked at the fast forward, they are designed for for riders 100kg.
Do people use these wheels all year round and for commuting or just for racing?
And would I notice the difference? I do like climbing hills,
Many thanks
Martin

these days I'm heavy so I probably couldn't ride those wheels without similar troubles. But when I was lighter I was still strong and I couldn't ride those kinds of wheels then either. Everything that could flex, flexed, and everything that could rub, rubbed.

IMHO the design of the wheels you have at present owes more to fashion than it does engineering.

Honestly, if you want a decent set of wheels for zooming around on the weekend ask yourself why not something like

- 32 x3 DB spokes
- Mavic Open Pro rims
- decent hubs

If you want to go belt and braces choose a 36h rear wheel; this will 'cost' about 30g, and no, you won't notice the difference. Such wheels won't be heavy, they will ride really well, and should last well if they are built properly. When the rims wear out or get bent you can have them rebuilt.

You mention commuting too; what makes you think that a set of flim-flam wheels that are (say) barely adequate for a 65kg bloke to race on a few times a year might have any chance of surviving in commuting duties? In the event of damage, how would you ever repair them? Truly, what are your priorities?

Note that simply because they won't be moving around all the time you will probably be faster on a set of open pros than on the rather flexy wheels you've been riding round on.

cheers

Hewitt charged me £300 for a pair of Open Pro / Ultegra wheels with 36 rear, 32 front. And they seem not to flex much. I weigh about 90kg, and I would not go for lighter wheels. When climbing, heavy wheels are not ideal, but brake rub is worse.

I wonder if having 3mm clearance for the blocks is just a bit too tight. Would 4mm make it work, and if it did, would the braking be acceptable?

[Zanda]

Agreed. When I read there was 3mm clearance I thought that seemed rather small, as I think I've run more than that on my DP brakes Edit: although they were Tektros with a deeper drop.

[Samuel D]

I wonder if having 3mm clearance for the blocks is just a bit too tight. Would 4mm make it work, and if it did, would the braking be acceptable?

Doubtful. For example, Shimano recommends 3–4 mm of combined left and right clearance for my BR-R650 callipers, i.e. 1.5–2 mm per side. Doubling that would risk the brake lever hitting the bars during hard braking, especially after some earlier hard braking on a wet ride. Less than perfectly prepared cable housings would become a safety liability. It might be just about safe in some cases, but I wouldn’t feel comfortable recommending it as a course of action for others. In all cases the brakes would seem less powerful with more clearance, because it’s harder to grasp a good handful of lever when the lever is close to the bars.

The real problem is that martinn’s wheels are too lightly built. I’d just get a proper set of hand-built wheels, but the allure of ultra-light wheels is strong to many cyclists, for reasons I don’t claim to understand except in racing.

[NATURAL ANKLING]

Hi,
Convert to disc's