Lower geared chainsets for Dawes or Ridgeback

[keyboardmonkey]

But the Deore range is MTB with a chainline optimised for use with a 135mm hub (hence the 2.5mm difference Brucy also refers to: 135 take away 130 divided by two). This meant that instead of the Panorama's middle chainring being aligned with the middle sprocket on the cassette it lined up with one of the smaller ones. It's not the end of the world, but it was enough of an issue for Ridgeback to change the chainset for later models. This explains why the 2015 models has:

According to the Ridgeback website the 2015 Panorama has wheels built on Shimano T610 hubs which still have 135mm axles.
cheers

I shall ask Spa if their frames will take an MTB/Trekking chainset but with 22-34-44 teeth. The more I think about it the more I realise that things will be much simpler if my 26 inch wheel bike and 700c bike use the same components, that way I can fill a big box with enough spares to last till the end of days and hopefully have no more of this mallarky.
cheers
ukpacker

I think it would be a good idea for Spa to put something together for you once you know what it is that you want.

seems like the op dont like his slow 26" bike with rather small chain rings & wants something faster so wants a 700c bike and then wants to make it slower with lower gears?...

I don't think that is entirely fair. Even with a 44T large chain ring that 11T sprocket will give a gear of about 107". With a cadence of 80rpm that would move you along at 25mph - not so slow for a touring bike, really. At the other extreme the 22T smallest chain ring and 32T sprocket will give a gear of around 18", which is what the OP appears to need.

[ukpacker]

So your question for Spa should be...."Can you build me a steel tourer with a 22, 32, 44 chainset and whatever shifters you want. (I have been retired 3 years, I'm out of date)....if you go for bar end levers, then you can have full-size Vee brakes

I shall certainly ask that question, but as their website lists no crankset available in 22-32-44 I am not too hopeful that this would be possible otherwise they would sell one wouldn't they?
cheers

[531colin]

So your question for Spa should be...."Can you build me a steel tourer with a 22, 32, 44 chainset and whatever shifters you want. (I have been retired 3 years, I'm out of date)....if you go for bar end levers, then you can have full-size Vee brakes

I shall certainly ask that question, but as their website lists no crankset available in 22-32-44 I am not too hopeful that this would be possible otherwise they would sell one wouldn't they?
cheers

This one i linked last time.......http://www.spacycles.co.uk/products.php?plid=m2b0s109p2657

[keyboardmonkey]

http://www.spacycles.co.uk/products.php?plid=m2b0s109p2657

That is a 4 bolt 22, 32, 42/44 square taper chainset
These bikes has Road STI levers, and were probably 9 speed, so at that time there was a 9 speed road front mech. that would handle those chainring sizes, at the chainline Spa were using.
If you want road STI levers, you have to have a road front mech...

So we're not ruling out the possibility that 9spd road STIs and a 9spd road front mech could work with the chainset pictured.

This is what freeflow posted elsewhere:

I'm using Ultegra 6603 STI with ultegra 6607 front mech and it seems to cope no matter what combination I throw at it. I did have a 52/44/24 combination at one stage but this was really only to try out what a 44/24 double would feel like, and my experience is why I went 44/32/22. I'm currently using a 9 speed XT shadow rear mech with a long cage and the shifting is very very good, Far more so than the original Ultegra rear mech or the conventional XT mech I was using before a chain problem trashed it.

If I hadn't gone over to 10spd recently I would be tempted to get one of the above chainsets and appropriate BB. "Use a 107mm JIS square taper bottom bracket" - Spa web site.

[ukpacker]

That looks like just what I want, only it is very cheap compared to other chainsets. Do you think a £35 chainset can be strong? I would be happy to buy a Custom TA chainset in that configuration but they don't list one...mmm?
Thanks for the suggestion.

[531colin]

That looks like just what I want, only it is very cheap compared to other chainsets. Do you think a £35 chainset can be strong? I would be happy to buy a Custom TA chainset in that configuration but they don't list one...mmm?
Thanks for the suggestion.

Its £35 because its bought from the Far East and sold directly to the public by just one business, who are prepared to accept a sensible markup.
The usual route is importer/wholesaler, who add nothing to the goods, but double the price.
If Spa trebled their markup, would this chainset be "better".....or just more expensive?

[Brucey]

-exactly.... IIRC that chainset design was originally sold as the 'specialized strongarm' (amongst others) and back then it cost over £50 (so £80 in todays money, I guess). At £35 it is a bargain.

The only thing I'd say is that the chainrings are not necessarily made of such hard material as in the most expensive chainsets. This means that they don't last as long and will wear more quickly if you let the chain stretch. Occasionally a strong rider will raise burrs on a small, soft chainring, even with a new chain. I'd suggest that you can easily change the chainrings for Zicral/steel ones if it turns into a problem, (which it doesn't for most folk).

cheers

[Neilo]

http://www.spacycles.co.uk/products.php?plid=m2b0s109p2657

That is a 4 bolt 22, 32, 42/44 square taper chainset
These bikes has Road STI levers, and were probably 9 speed, so at that time there was a 9 speed road front mech. that would handle those chainring sizes, at the chainline Spa were using.

Sorry to hijack. I'm looking at making up a Drop bar off roader, bit like the new Genesis Vagabond and want lower gearing.
I wold be interested to know if there is a road front mech that was compatible with a MTB size chain set.

Neil

[Brucey]

Sorry to hijack. I'm looking at making up a Drop bar off roader, bit like the new Genesis Vagabond and want lower gearing.
I wold be interested to know if there is a road front mech that was compatible with a MTB size chain set.

Neil

how many speeds are you running, what chainstay angle (wheel size will vary this) what seat tube dia/fitting, and what chainline? Are you planning to use road STIs or other shifters?

cheers

[Neilo]

Nothing concrete yet.
Sitting at home off work, sick with kidney stones, planning a project for the future.
Hard tail MTB frame, which I have, don't even know what make it is, a mate gave it to me. 26" wheels, rigid forks. 9 spd STI road shifters.
MTB chain line, or maybe a bit less as I spend most time on the big rear rings. 31-32mm seat tube dia. not sure of the chain stay angle.
As I said, just in the planning/dreaming stage at the moment.
Whatever it is going to turn into, it is going to be minimum cost, and in stealth mode, so that SHWMBO does not realise that the number of bikes in the garage has increased

Neil

[ukpacker]

The gentleman at Spa told me the lowest gearing they will build into their tourer is 24t front 34t back. Not sure why that is ? Someone else told me that there is no issue fitting MTB cranksets to touring frames as such but the front mech may not be at the best angle due to MTB front mechs being designed for a different geometry. However many MTB frames seem to have 73 degree seat tubes, the same as touring frames. MTBs have higher bottom brackets which perhaps might create more clearance for the front mech cage in relation to the chainstay. However the Cheviot uses an XT front mech ok and so does my XTC though comparing the XTC with photos of MTBs I can see that the MTBs have a bit more clearance from back of mech cage to chainstay. So now I am thinking that bottom bracket height and corresponding chainstay angle will be key to determining how well placed an MTB mech can be.
Thanks
ukpacker

[Brucey]

shimano front mechs have specification for the included angle between the seat tube and the chainstay. [This is normally included in the SI techdoc, but gawd knows where you find it now they have turned their website to junk; the 'user manual' is a waste of time and the 'dealer manual has sod-all in it..... ]

This angle plus the chainring size, the chainstay diameter etc determines the clearance for the tail of the front mech.

Often when comparing a touring bike with an MTB it is a double whammy; not only does the chainstay angle vary but so does the seat tube angle.

cheers

[ukpacker]

It was interesting to note that freeflow has successfully converted his tourer to MTB gearing. I have sent a private message asking what frame he rides.
cheers

[RickH]

I've not personally used one but there does appear to be a solution to the road shifters/ MTB front mech (or vice versa) conundrum in the form of the Jtek Shiftmate no7, which appears to be made for that specific problem.

Rick.

[markfh]

In response to Brucey's (perhaps rhetorical) question, Shimano now appear to publish a separate document for the specification (try searching for "Shimano spec manual"). A version of the shimano specification can be found here (http://productinfo.shimano.com/#/spec/2.4) - or at least today - and there is a link there to download the Spec. Manual.

A quick skim of this information shows that the majority of MTB front dérailleurs appear to cover a chainstay angle range of 66-69 degrees although some cover 63-66 and I did notice one that said 63-69 degrees, whereas road front dérailleurs seem to be generally specced for a chainstay angle of either 61-66 degrees or 63-66 degrees.