Touring bike choice for people with long legs

[aflook]

buying the wrong bike is costly all right.....which is why its preferable to get the position sorted on an existing bike, with a steerer extender, etc.
Why is a sloping top tube counter-intuitive? If you have a short torso for your height, (the other way of saying long legs for your height) you are liable to want the bars high....which is why sloping tubes are popular anyway.
Sitting on top of the pedals with a long stem....OK if you can manage it...I could, 30 years ago.
Do you have any dimensions of your custom frame? Just off the cuff i would guess short, sloping top tube, from the frame sizes you mention toe overlap shouldn't be a problem.
I don't have a problem with "variations" in riding style, but if somebody is uncomfortable on their existing bike, a conventional riding position is the first thing to try, isn't it? Nobody can guarantee to find an off-the-peg bike which will give instant comfort for a rider who insists on a position way outside the normal range.

Sloping top tube is counter-intuitive (counter to my intuition anyway ) as I would expect a fame to have a longer seat-tube to fit longer legs - but I take your point. I always thought sloping top-tubes were to increase standover height which is not an issue for me. As for riding position - why is "sitting on top of te pedals with a long stem" likely to be problematic? I am averagley fit and 57 and it seems to suit me that way. Maybe I should start worrying?! Could life be easier if I changed position?!! The custom bike was traditional touring geometry but with slightly longer seat- and head-tubes. Haven't got the exact measurements.

[531colin]

Having the saddle forward (sitting on top of the pedals) with a long stem throws weight onto your hands. Its a popular position with racing cyclists because they can get down low for aero benefits, and they are pedalling hard enough for the "equal and opposite" reaction force to support their torso. Lots of people complain of sore shoulders, wrists, etc because they have too much weight on their hands, but if you can do it, its obviously OK for you. (I'm 10 years older than you .)

Traditional touring geo. with longer seat and head tubes is the other way of saying traditional touring geo. with a short top tube... ....like my old black bike pictured here http://forum.ctc.org.uk/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=95724&hilit=black&start=60

[Vorpal]

There are other alternatives than just drops or straights...

I have trekking (butterfly) bars on one of my bikes. There are also the north road and bull horn type bars. A conversion fro straights to north road bars, would also have the effect of shortening the reach, and making your position on the bike more upright.

[531colin]

There are other alternatives than just drops or straights...

I have trekking (butterfly) bars on one of my bikes. There are also the north road and bull horn type bars. A conversion fro straights to north road bars, would also have the effect of shortening the reach, and making your position on the bike more upright.

On the face of it, there is a contradiction in having a short top tube and then drops.....my reasoning is that the multiple hand positions offered by drops completely trump the disadvantages. (plural disadvantages....greater reach, and shifter/brake/gear combinations)
..........(there is perhaps more of a contradiction in having a frame specially made with a short top tube and then fitting long stem.....one wonders if a production bike and a regular stem would suffice? ).

[Vorpal]

There are other alternatives than just drops or straights...

I have trekking (butterfly) bars on one of my bikes. There are also the north road and bull horn type bars. A conversion fro straights to north road bars, would also have the effect of shortening the reach, and making your position on the bike more upright.

On the face of it, there is a contradiction in having a short top tube and then drops.....my reasoning is that the multiple hand positions offered by drops completely trump the disadvantages. (plural disadvantages....greater reach, and shifter/brake/gear combinations)
..........(there is perhaps more of a contradiction in having a frame specially made with a short top tube and then fitting long stem.....one wonders if a production bike and a regular stem would suffice? ).

I prefer drops for their advantages, but I have toured on the bike with trekking bars and found it generally comfortable. One of the biggest advantages to drops is the many different hand positions available. I think that trekking bars are the next best when it comes to number of available hand positions.

[samsbike]

I've actually been wondering whether, after I get the new bike, whether it's worth paying for a bike fit. Let's assume I go for the Thorn, yes they will set me up though I have to tell them how relaxed or sporty I want the position, and then I can fine tune the position myself. But is it worth getting one of these bells and whistles bike fits as well perhaps? It seems to me a lot of them are focused on racing fits (I spoke to one Retul fitter recently who said as much and that they'd basically have to ignore most of what the system tells them making it pointless)? Or do you think I may still learn something from the experience that would be useful to me in the future? If so, does anyone know a good fitter in South Wales or South-West England?

This thread has been very helpful, thanks for all your input.

TBH I would have the bike fit done first.

I would also say that after 3 years of fiddling I got myself fitted as I lost faith in my own ability. Oddly enough he set up seat height to where I had it 3 years ago and bang in line with what Colin recommended for me. My setback went forward 1cm, everything else was about spot on.

Now I only had this done about 2 weeks ago and am still dialing in. However, my shoulder ache, which the fitter said had nothing to do with cycling, has gone down enough for me to do a 100km sportive. It still gets tight but I have terrible posture. I am hoping it decreases. I think what has helped more to alleviate it, is that I move around a lot more on the bike - hoods, tops, drops etc. I am also careful to push them back more.

A good bike fit is not cheap and I still wonder whether I could have done without it, and I think not as its given me a toolkit where I know what good should feel like.

[531colin]

You might have been better paying a physio. to sort your shoulder out than having a bike fit.....but how do you know until you do it?

[reohn2]

You might have been better paying a physio. to sort your shoulder out than having a bike fit.....but how do you know until you do it?

I agree about the physio,and I'd go and see a good Yoga teacher to help with flexibility too perhaps mentioning it to the Physio first.

[samsbike]

Physio is next step and I have been doing yoga since last September. I guess every bit helps. My neck flexion is poor and posture is poor. Guess I should have taken up running lol.

[22camels]

This thread has gone off on a few tangents but as the OP, I thought I'd bring you up to date on where I have go to with this:

- the question in my original post was a bit misguided and a few more experienced posters pointed out I have issues with bike fit

- I had been considering it for a while anyway, but eventually decided to get some professional bike fitting help on my current bike, although I know I won't be riding it for much longer (I will be replacing it with a touring specific bike), and I was pretty skeptical, it turned out very helpful, I think.

- the main thing I learnt from the fit was that it's as much about my working on my own posture, as it is about the bike geometry. I have a tendency to ride with a hunched back (with the shoulders also hunched forward) this makes loads of sense to me as I know I have this tendency off the bike too, and apparently this was causing the neck discomfort, and if I work on my posture, by keeping more of a straight back, and getting more forward bend from the bottom of the spine, it should gradually lead to more comfort.

- some small bike adjustments were recommended, such as saddle height (I had lowered it a lot since the original post here, it was raised a bit), and bars were lowered, a more sporty position resulted overall with more weight on the hands. Interestingly, I also took a completely different saddle on trial (a Selle SMP dynamic) as this supposedly would encourage a better posture, in a way that my former saddle, the Brooks (Flyer Imperial) had apparently been encouraging me to ride hunched up.

- shortly afterwards, I went on a week long tour. I rode 750km in 7 days with no rest day and loads of climbing, with very little training. I tried as much as I could to focus on my posture, but inevitably often fell back to old habits when tired esp when climbing. In any case, I was overall very satisfied with my comfort levels over the week. There was discomfort, but much better than my most recent multi-day experience (400km in 4 days two months prior). There could be 3 factors at play here: a) the bike fit and the posture changes working. b) improved flexibility - i had been working on it for about 3 weeks by doing some basic yoga. c) a case of spending hours in the saddle and the body adjusting. I think c) can be ruled out, so probably a bit of both a) and b). I didn't have any neck pain for the first three days actually, but would often get lower back pain that I don't recall ever getting before, I needed to stop to stretch quite a few times to handle it.

- still a work in progress and could be a case of stepping sideways, but am much happier about it for now. One thing that's certain is that my previous inclination to "go more upright" to deal with the neck pain was too simplistic.

[531colin]

Glad to hear you are making progress.
As I write fairly often on these pages, if somebody is uncomfortable on their bike, its not always the bike thats causing the discomfort, it can be random stuff like pre-existing injuries or bad posture in front of a computer all day.
On the other hand, if you are uncomfortable, then a conventional riding position should be among the first things to try......if you insist on a riding position far removed from the usual range then nobody can recommend a bike that will be magically "comfortable".