On 12th May, 3 of us, 2 Belgian and 1 Brit, living in Belgium hope to start a long cycle ride following (as closely as possible) the Via Francigena pilgrim's route from Canterbury to Rome. For personal reasons, I would like our little trio (average age 60) to start from Drakefell Road in the New Cross/ Brockley area of South London. I have seen that there is a biking-commuter's route to and from London and Canterbury but am not quite sure how to negotiate a ride - remembering that riding on the left will be a challenge to begin with - between New Cross and a suitable place on the said bike-commuter route. Can anyone help us?
We are also looking for cheap and bike -friendly accommodation in the Dartford area... We would be very grateful for any advice or practical help to see us on our way.
Many thanks in advance. Theresa
3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
Welcome to the forum.
A very helpful route planning website is http://www.cycle.travel
It would be useful to know what route you've already found. I'm guessing it's NCN1. If you are not familiar with the National Cycle Network you may wish to know that routes (in parts) can be circuitous, poorly surfaced and involve barriers that can be difficult to negotiate with laden bikes.
I'm happy to provide more detailed info on much of the route if that is the way you have chosen. If it's any other route I'll do my best and I'm sure there will be more help along shortly.
A very helpful route planning website is http://www.cycle.travel
It would be useful to know what route you've already found. I'm guessing it's NCN1. If you are not familiar with the National Cycle Network you may wish to know that routes (in parts) can be circuitous, poorly surfaced and involve barriers that can be difficult to negotiate with laden bikes.
I'm happy to provide more detailed info on much of the route if that is the way you have chosen. If it's any other route I'll do my best and I'm sure there will be more help along shortly.
High on a cocktail of flossy teacakes and marmalade
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
Best of luck with the trip.
I can back up gaz's caution about bits of NCN1.
I would create your own route.
Will you be taking tents?
Do keep us updated on your plans and progress.
I intend to ride to rome someday.
As a local (ish)
I must admit to being intrigued by the starting point - apologies for kinda asking if it is too personal.
I can back up gaz's caution about bits of NCN1.
I would create your own route.
Will you be taking tents?
Do keep us updated on your plans and progress.
I intend to ride to rome someday.
As a local (ish)
I must admit to being intrigued by the starting point - apologies for kinda asking if it is too personal.
Sweep
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
Please note you have no particular priority over roundabouts! Here you have to pretend to be a car for these! Give way to all vehicles approaching from the right at them. NCN1 from Sittingbourne onwards is fair, except for the first stretch out of town. Thereafter it is probably your best routes to Dover but from Canterbury it is lumpy - tiring little hills.
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
The bit across the shorne marshes between gravesend and higham is a really nice bit of NCN1 but that is one of the bits with problem barriers. I went fully loaded along there a couple of years ago and had to unload the bike once or twice to get through. A right pain , particularly as, from memory, the barriers were actually of different specs.
I would also look at using route 177 for bits of the trip.
I would also look at using route 177 for bits of the trip.
Sweep
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
Sweep wrote:The bit across the shorne marshes between gravesend and higham is a really nice bit of NCN1 but that is one of the bits with problem barriers. I went fully loaded along there a couple of years ago and had to unload the bike once or twice to get through. A right pain , particularly as, from memory, the barriers were actually of different specs.
I would also look at using route 177 for bits of the trip.
also bone jarring for anything other than a mt bike.... avoid.
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
Hi mercalia
I was on a hybrid with 37 or 38mm tyres, no suspension, and found it fine from that point of view.
Barriers best avoided though, i agree.
I was on a hybrid with 37 or 38mm tyres, no suspension, and found it fine from that point of view.
Barriers best avoided though, i agree.
Sweep
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
My detailed knowledge of NCN1 stretches from Dartford to Rainham. I've a passing familiarity with it to Sittingbourne, Faversham and Canterbury. Since we are discussing barriers.
NCN1 from Erith to Dartford has at least one (probably two) of these:
Possibly the most impenetrable barrier I've ever come across.
NCN1 from Gravesend to Higham has three of these:
The gate beside the one at the Gravesend end is always unlocked* and can be opened instead of negotiating the barrier. The middle one (pictured) may/may not be by-passable depending on the state of amateur repairs to the adjacent fencing. The gate by the Higham end is usually locked (unlocked last Wednesday, probably forced, might not be fixed by May).
NCN1 from Gillingham to Rainham has twelve of the above type plus a couple of "P" frames for good measure. If you can negotiate the "A" frames the "P"s won't be a problem.
NCN177 is a very useful shortcut but it's much noisier. It has seven** of these:
Two can be bypassed with a short stretch of road.
* After an 18 month absence a lock has reappeared. Higham gate also locked again.
** Now nine
.
NCN1 from Erith to Dartford has at least one (probably two) of these:
Possibly the most impenetrable barrier I've ever come across.
NCN1 from Gravesend to Higham has three of these:
The gate beside the one at the Gravesend end is always unlocked* and can be opened instead of negotiating the barrier. The middle one (pictured) may/may not be by-passable depending on the state of amateur repairs to the adjacent fencing. The gate by the Higham end is usually locked (unlocked last Wednesday, probably forced, might not be fixed by May).
NCN1 from Gillingham to Rainham has twelve of the above type plus a couple of "P" frames for good measure. If you can negotiate the "A" frames the "P"s won't be a problem.
NCN177 is a very useful shortcut but it's much noisier. It has seven** of these:
Two can be bypassed with a short stretch of road.
* After an 18 month absence a lock has reappeared. Higham gate also locked again.
** Now nine
.
Last edited by gaz on 9 Aug 2016, 8:25pm, edited 3 times in total.
High on a cocktail of flossy teacakes and marmalade
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
Do NOT consider NCN17 Pilgrims Cycle Trail from Rochester to Canterbury (unless you enjoy mud in huge quantities and lifting loaded bikes through horse stiles).
High on a cocktail of flossy teacakes and marmalade
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
Sweep wrote:Hi mercalia
I was on a hybrid with 37 or 38mm tyres, no suspension, and found it fine from that point of view.
Barriers best avoided though, i agree.
Well I rode on it late last summer and didnt like it maybe they had put more rough core after you used it. some bits just hard earth ok.it was the later bits after Shorne fort.
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
There was considerable work to the path in 2011 including a change to the type of barriers.
The path's current surface is made from crushed road stone and was laid in March 2011. The degree of crushing was somewhat variable. Opinions differ locally as to whether the wrong grade of stone was used or whether an intended top-surface was never laid. In either case the resulting surface was widely considered extremely uncomfortable to ride on.
The stretch from Gravesend to Shornemead crossing is wide enough for motor vehicles. It is regularly used by 4x4s providing security for the adjacent firing range and sees less frequent use by Railtrack, National Grid and RSPB as access to their own sites along the route. It also sees illegal use by other vehicles since the padlock on the Gravesend gate was removed around September 2013.
Whilst the vehicular use has provided some additional compression of the surface it remains rough and uncomfortable and has become severely potholed*.
Sustrans do not consider the surface to be suitable for road bikes. It's part of my regular commuting route on 700x28s without suspension, I'll be switching to 700x32s when they wear out.
If anything the path has probably deteriorated since mercalia's last visit.
The shorter and narrower stretch from Shornemead to Higham did receive a top dressing of a much more finely graded material. It was applied somewhat unevenly and has washed away in parts but is still a much more comfortable section to ride.
Edit: Just found a pic of the surface at the Higham end shortly after it was first laid and before it got any dressing.
*Edit 2: Potholes have been patch filled and spread with type 1 MoT. Much improved, interesting to see how long it lasts.
The path's current surface is made from crushed road stone and was laid in March 2011. The degree of crushing was somewhat variable. Opinions differ locally as to whether the wrong grade of stone was used or whether an intended top-surface was never laid. In either case the resulting surface was widely considered extremely uncomfortable to ride on.
The stretch from Gravesend to Shornemead crossing is wide enough for motor vehicles. It is regularly used by 4x4s providing security for the adjacent firing range and sees less frequent use by Railtrack, National Grid and RSPB as access to their own sites along the route. It also sees illegal use by other vehicles since the padlock on the Gravesend gate was removed around September 2013.
Whilst the vehicular use has provided some additional compression of the surface it remains rough and uncomfortable and has become severely potholed*.
Sustrans do not consider the surface to be suitable for road bikes. It's part of my regular commuting route on 700x28s without suspension, I'll be switching to 700x32s when they wear out.
If anything the path has probably deteriorated since mercalia's last visit.
The shorter and narrower stretch from Shornemead to Higham did receive a top dressing of a much more finely graded material. It was applied somewhat unevenly and has washed away in parts but is still a much more comfortable section to ride.
Edit: Just found a pic of the surface at the Higham end shortly after it was first laid and before it got any dressing.
*Edit 2: Potholes have been patch filled and spread with type 1 MoT. Much improved, interesting to see how long it lasts.
Last edited by gaz on 9 Aug 2016, 8:23pm, edited 2 times in total.
High on a cocktail of flossy teacakes and marmalade
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
its a real shame as it is a very pleasant ride. But now if I want to get to Shorne fort I take one of the 2 short foot paths that leave the parallel road and cross the rail way line. - lots of blackberries last time I looked on one of the longer paths
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
All I can suggest is you avoid the Thames cycle path which runs through Greenwich and out east. Tortuous, badly signed and surfaced and blocked in parts. These two photos show parts of it west of Greenwich.
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Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
First of all... many thanks to all of you who have given us a mine of information. I hadn't checked the forum until today and frankly am overwhelmed by the response and help.
I have cycled parts of the NCN routes and yes, have found them very nice for short discovery routes but very convoluted for longer rides so... we shall plot our own route following your collective advice. I shall now print off everything and see how we can best do this. If you're in the London (NEw Cross to Bromley) to Canterbury area sometime between 13th May and 15th May you may catch sight of us as we sail by waving Belgian Uk and Italian flags!
Many thanks. Theresa
I have cycled parts of the NCN routes and yes, have found them very nice for short discovery routes but very convoluted for longer rides so... we shall plot our own route following your collective advice. I shall now print off everything and see how we can best do this. If you're in the London (NEw Cross to Bromley) to Canterbury area sometime between 13th May and 15th May you may catch sight of us as we sail by waving Belgian Uk and Italian flags!
Many thanks. Theresa
Re: 3 ladies from Belgium travelling from London to Dover
I'll make a few more observations about NCN1 that may help you planning your own.
Whilst NCN177 makes a good short cut there's a one mile gap between it and NCN1 in Strood where the route meets the main A2 through the Medway Towns, 30mph limit. It's down hill/flat but you will be on the carriageway. NCN1 is longer but quieter and much more scenic once you've passed Gravesend.
NCN1 continues to use the main A2 through Rochester, on a shared path at first but dumping you back on the carriageway for the last 500m or so. Easily bypassed by using the old High Street as soon as you have crossed over the bridge. You'll have to walk against a one-way street for the first 500m but it has much more character.
The stretch through Riverside Country Park is rather wiggly compared with the adjacent B2004 but there are some great views across the river to make up for it.
It is widely considered to be impossible to follow NCN1 through Sittingbourne using the signing alone. Faversham to Whitstable is either via NCN1 or nearby roads through Graveney and Seasalter.
IMO you are unlikely to find a better route into Canterbury than NCN1 from Whitstable, aka the Crab and Winkle Line.
That stretch has a number of barriers similar to this: https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=whitst ... 180,,1,7.5 Great views of the Cathedral as you descend into Canterbury.
Enjoy your trip.
Whilst NCN177 makes a good short cut there's a one mile gap between it and NCN1 in Strood where the route meets the main A2 through the Medway Towns, 30mph limit. It's down hill/flat but you will be on the carriageway. NCN1 is longer but quieter and much more scenic once you've passed Gravesend.
NCN1 continues to use the main A2 through Rochester, on a shared path at first but dumping you back on the carriageway for the last 500m or so. Easily bypassed by using the old High Street as soon as you have crossed over the bridge. You'll have to walk against a one-way street for the first 500m but it has much more character.
The stretch through Riverside Country Park is rather wiggly compared with the adjacent B2004 but there are some great views across the river to make up for it.
It is widely considered to be impossible to follow NCN1 through Sittingbourne using the signing alone. Faversham to Whitstable is either via NCN1 or nearby roads through Graveney and Seasalter.
IMO you are unlikely to find a better route into Canterbury than NCN1 from Whitstable, aka the Crab and Winkle Line.
That stretch has a number of barriers similar to this: https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=whitst ... 180,,1,7.5 Great views of the Cathedral as you descend into Canterbury.
Enjoy your trip.
High on a cocktail of flossy teacakes and marmalade