Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Cycle-touring, Expeditions, Adventures, Major cycle routes NOT LeJoG (see other special board)
Vorpal
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by Vorpal »

JBB wrote:I have the Edinburgh coop bike. It's a lovely ride and the gearing is good for a full load. However one of the tyres failed within days and the wheels are 32 spoke and past versions do not have a good reputation. I had no problems getting EBC to replace the tyre but swapped the wheels for a set of 36 spoke ones I had already, relegating the 32s to the hack.

I don't know the particular wheels, but I have some 32 spoke wheels that are 20 years old (they look similar, but maybe they are Rigida or something; whatever Raleigh was using on their entry level MTBs & hybrids 20 years ago). They have seen many miles of loaded touring, child carrying duties, weekly shopping, club riding, etc. I have in all that time, replaced 5 spokes. The brake surface is getting worn, and I will replace them, or at least the rims in the relatively near future.

It somewhat depends on what will be carried, but, IMO, 32 spokes is enough for many (maybe most) people doing loaded touring. It may not be enough for heavy people or a rough stuff expedition, but we're talking about a European tour. I'd have no qualms about doing the trip on 32 spoke wheels.
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ndxcc
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by ndxcc »

Again thanks for the information, things like wheel spokes are so off my radar - I just didn't realise I'd have to think about that!

Regarding second hand. I still have a couple of issues which mean I can't go down that route. Firstly that I'm really limited on time and finding a secondhand bike, in my area, specifically for touring and in my frame size (small) is really quite difficult. Secondly, even if I happened to chance on a bike I actually wouldn't know what I was looking at. The seller could feasibly remove all the decent components and replace them with cheap alternatives and I wouldn't even know.

I'm seeing the Revolution again tonight for a test ride.

Hopefully be test riding the Dawes and Fuji soon too, but they have to be ordered in.

There's also this, reduced at Evans. They seem to have a few Jamis bikes, but are they any good?

Jamis Aurora 2015 Touring Bike
http://www.evanscycles.com/products/jam ... 0#features
nirakaro
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by nirakaro »

I think in your particular circumstances, you’re wise to go for a new bike.
Re the spoke count, there is a tendency on forums like this to counsel perfection. If you’re very big, or carry a very heavy load, or ride very hard over rough surfaces, it could be an issue; but I’ve toured for years on 32-spoke wheels, never thought about it, and never had a problem.
BTW, whereabouts in Leeds are you?
JBB
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by JBB »

Don't get me wrong I'm not saying 32 spokes is no good. However the wheels reviewed are machine built and judging by the set I have, the weak point on a good bike. I also suspect the poster is going to hit some poor surfaces on the way to Istanbul and confesses to little knowledge about bikes. E. G Do they know how to true a wheel or replace a spoke? Hence my comment.......
ndxcc
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by ndxcc »

nirakaro wrote:I think in your particular circumstances, you’re wise to go for a new bike.
Re the spoke count, there is a tendency on forums like this to counsel perfection.


Yeah perfection counselling is great and I thank those that provide it, it's the best way for me to learn. However, even though I'll take it all on board... I might not abide by everything. For example with the spoke count; if the bike has 32 spokes then I'm going with 32 spokes. My knowledge and budget don't really stretch to replacing wheels just yet.

But please all, please still recommend the best ways :)

nirakaro wrote:BTW, whereabouts in Leeds are you?


City centre, can you recommend any routes I can practice on?
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Sweep
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by Sweep »

Vorpal wrote: However, if you are planign to use front panniers, I agree that it's better to get a bike with mounting for a front rack.

It's not a big issue is it? Tubus do some fittings for about £7 which you can screw onto the forks. I have some on the chro-mo forks of my hybrid. Being tubus they are solid as a rock. Couldn't use them on carbon of course but then i wouldn't use carbon anywhere on a tourer anyway.

Edit - here they are. A bit more than £7 but well worth it if it gives more flexibility/economy on bike choice.
http://www.wiggle.co.uk/tubus-lm-1-moun ... o-eyelets/
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by ndxcc »

Sweep wrote:Edit - here they are. A bit more than £7 but well worth it if it gives more flexibility/economy on bike choice.
http://www.wiggle.co.uk/tubus-lm-1-moun ... o-eyelets/


Thanks Sweep that's really great as I'm actually test riding the eyelet-less Eastway on Wednesday next week.

Also - I just test rode the Revolution Traveller and ... it was truly amazing, however it might be that I've not ridden a bike in years! It'll be good to test ride the Eastway next week as I want to see if I notice a big difference between a £550 bike and a £899 bike.
Erizo
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by Erizo »

Hi ndxcc, I have a 2013 Surly Disc Trucker frame and fork, size 48, in case you might be interested. You would have to build all the other pieces, but probably you can get them for cheap. It is a really good bike, and I can give you a good price, as it was involved in a small road accident.
I'm living in London, and am planning to do my trip back home in sout-eastern Spain, leaving exactly the same day as you! I'm planning to be on the road for about a month, but this is a rough estimate, as it will be my very first bike tour! I was really surprised to read the details of your trip, it looks really similar to what I have in mind, as I'm planning to wild camp and use warmshowers too, all to spend as little money as possible.

Contact me if you're interested on the bike, or want to talk about anything relating the trip. It will also be a first for me, so it would be good to share with you.

BTW, this is my first post!
nirakaro
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by nirakaro »

City centre, can you recommend any routes I can practice on?

Otley-Ilkley-Bolton Abbey is a nice run from Leeds: you can take back roads over the Chevin through Cookridge, cross the Wharfe in Otley, back road through Askwith to Ilkley, then Addingham, climb up to Embsay. Or just follow the main road, a bit busy but hoaching with cyclists. Twenty-odd miles if you just do Otley and back, fifty plus if you go through to Skipton. And your GPS will tell you you’ve climbed 1200 metres or so (whether it’s telling the truth though…).
Or for something flatter, try Oakwood-Scholes-Barwick-Aberford-Sherburn-Kippax-Woodlesford-Temple Newsam.
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DaveP
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by DaveP »

Nothing wrong with trying a few different bikes before laying your cash down - its all part of the fun. Just don't lose track of the passage of time. Ok, ok, I have had kids you know! - wont nag anymore :D
Luggage isn't quite like the human body, attached to its bike via springy arms and legs and with resilient padding at the point where most of the weight acts. Luggage is a dead weight, a continuous downwards force pulling its point of support, and for most of that weight this will be the rear wheel - the one which also supports your backside, down into every irregularity in the road surface. If you ride the same stretch loaded and unloaded you will notice a different ride quality. Instead of bobbing gently over minor bumps the loaded wheel will bump upwards and then slam down. It can be quite unpleasant and quite tiring too.
Touring bikes are designed to make the best of this situation. Slacker frame and steering angles allow the frame itself to absorb some of the shock so that your rear end doesn't have to. I think you should bear in mind that a bike built without eyelets is rather unlikely to have that sort of geometry
I'm not suggesting that other types of bike might not be "up to it" I expect they could cope. The real issue is comfort. You'll be on that saddle for a while...
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ndxcc
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by ndxcc »

Erizo - As mentioned in previous posts, I'm really not clued up enough to buy a second-hand bike, even less so to buy components to build my own. If you're heading the same route as me, or around where I might be then let me know! Watch out for future posts where I'll explain my plan (and probably ask for more advice!)

nirakaro - Thanks for the routes, sounds like a good option. I'll also be cycling the 30miles back to my parents in Holmfirth. If yourself or anyone is up for a companion around Leeds / Bradford / Huddersfield let me know!

DaveP - Great advice and insight again, thanks. My issue is that with my budget I'll never be able to get the 'perfect' touring bike that covers all angles. The Revolution has 32 spoke wheels, the Eastway has no front eyelets, the Jamis has bar-end shifters. There's probably always going to be something lacking, due to the price range I'm looking at. I'll just have to go with my gut instinct and how comfortable they are on test rides.
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DaveP
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by DaveP »

ndxcc wrote:with my budget I'll never be able to get the 'perfect' touring bike that covers all angles. The Revolution has 32 spoke wheels, the Eastway has no front eyelets, the Jamis has bar-end shifters. There's probably always going to be something lacking, due to the price range I'm looking at.


I think most people find themselves in that position at all price levels below that of a full custom build - and even then you hear about people having second thoughts...
If the above points are crucial to your decision here's another perspective. I've already commented on the Eastway. I would agree that the fittings recommended by Sweep look like a decent fix as far as that goes, but its still the same fork legs. The Revolution spoke count isn't going to be resolved by anything short of a wheel change. But bar end shifters?
If that's the only black mark you should take a long hard look at the Jamis. There are folk on here who choose bar end shifters for touring. They do so because they are more robust and more fixable than STI. They are also more versatile. Everything has to be just so for STI to work well. A bit of damage to a mech from, say, a loaded bike falling over and you can expect problems. Bar ends can cope better. The front shifter will always be a friction control. This isn't as bad as it sounds because there are never more than three positions to find - up, down and in the middle. The rear shifter will normally have a click for each sprocket, which is useful in normal circumstances. However they can usually be reset to friction mode. The advantage of friction mode is that it allows you to fine tune the position of the mechanism, which can make all the difference if something is slightly misaligned.
You wouldn't have to spend a penny over this "problem", just put in a little practice. You're going to be training anyway...
HTH
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JBB
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by JBB »

So by dint of elimination and given your budget I'd suggest you test ride the Dawes Galaxy Al. It has 36 spoke wheels and STI shifters.
HTH
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by ndxcc »

DaveP wrote: But bar end shifters? ...


DaveP - apologies I didn't mean to state they were a negative, just that I'd never used them... but to be fair I'd never used STI shifters either before Thursday! So I definitely take your point on board and I'm looking forward to trying them out on Monday and see what the Jamis handles like. The only reason I actually brought them up was that no one has (yet) said anything negative (or positive for that matter) about the Jamis.

JBB - Julia - I was considering the Dawes, but for some reason, it's always come across as a cheap brand to me, probably because they're always the cheapest bikes on the Evans website.

Is the Dawes Galaxy AL a good bike? Does anyone have an opinion on the Jamis?
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Re: Rotterdam > Istanbul - Which bike?

Post by Vorpal »

Dawes have a good reputation. IMO, they are decent bikes. I don't get on with them because they (all the ones I've tried) have long top tubes. I have a short torso, so that doesn't work well for me.
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