touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Cycle-touring, Expeditions, Adventures, Major cycle routes NOT LeJoG (see other special board)
TonyR
Posts: 5390
Joined: 31 Aug 2008, 12:51pm

Re: touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Post by TonyR »

pwa wrote:You can tour on anything you like, so long as you can carry your kit on it. It is worth asking about these things while you still have a choice though. Personally, I'd avoid any technology that I can't work on by a roadside, just to avoid unnecessary hassle. That would include electronic gears (not likely on a touring bike anyway) and hydraulics. And I'd make sure I knew how to do basic repairs to the components I did take.


Yes, you can tour on anything you like. But there is nothing in a hydraulic brake that you can't work on by the roadside either. I just don't understand this negativity of cable brake users about hydraulic brakes - much of it based on perceptions rather than experience.

Hydraulics are much more reliable than cable brakes and need much less maintenance - why do you think hydraulics are the norm on motor vehicles? The worst that's going to happen if one fails is you are going to have to ride on one brake until you get the other fixed and if you can't do it yourself any competent garage mechanic could do it for you as they work on hydraulic systems all the time. And car mechanics are far more common around the world than bike shops.
m-gineering
Posts: 254
Joined: 23 May 2015, 12:01pm

Re: touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Post by m-gineering »

TonyR wrote:Yes, you can tour on anything you like. But there is nothing in a hydraulic brake that you can't work on by the roadside either.

I just don't understand this negativity of cable brake users about hydraulic brakes - much of it based on perceptions rather than experience.


Are you telling me that you are carrying a drill and a hammer in your toolkit to remove and replace rivets to take a brakelever apart? Love to know where you buy the seals btw

Hydraulics are much more reliable than cable brakes and need much less maintenance - why do you think hydraulics are the norm on motor vehicles?

hydraulics can be made very reliable, if that is your design goal. If however the design goal is shiny, lightweight and compact, reliabilty takes a backseat. I've yet to come across a automotive diskbrake without a dustseal, or a bicycle diskbrake with one.
Marten

Touring advice for NL: www.m-gineering.nl/touringg.htm
pwa
Posts: 17371
Joined: 2 Oct 2011, 8:55pm

Re: touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Post by pwa »

TonyR wrote:
pwa wrote:You can tour on anything you like, so long as you can carry your kit on it. It is worth asking about these things while you still have a choice though. Personally, I'd avoid any technology that I can't work on by a roadside, just to avoid unnecessary hassle. That would include electronic gears (not likely on a touring bike anyway) and hydraulics. And I'd make sure I knew how to do basic repairs to the components I did take.


Yes, you can tour on anything you like. But there is nothing in a hydraulic brake that you can't work on by the roadside either. I just don't understand this negativity of cable brake users about hydraulic brakes - much of it based on perceptions rather than experience.

Hydraulics are much more reliable than cable brakes and need much less maintenance - why do you think hydraulics are the norm on motor vehicles? The worst that's going to happen if one fails is you are going to have to ride on one brake until you get the other fixed and if you can't do it yourself any competent garage mechanic could do it for you as they work on hydraulic systems all the time. And car mechanics are far more common around the world than bike shops.


In about 50 years of cycling the only brake that has failed, 100%, on a descent, was a hydraulic disc brake. I was glad that my other brakes were vees so were not going to let me down in the same way. I also think that, unlike with motor vehicles, hydraulics are not needed. Properly set up vee brakes will lock the wheels of a heavily loaded bike, as will a cable operated disc brake. Even in the wet. Cantilevers are less inspiring but still adequate. And with a bit of forethought you can have spare cables, pre-cut to length, in your tool bag, weighing practically nothing and taking up next to no space. Not that you are ever likely to need them. My brake fettling on tour (with cantis) has never involved more than turning an adjuster or, at most, spending five minutes changing the blocks. I've never had cable problems.
reohn2
Posts: 45158
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Post by reohn2 »

One point,which may seem trivial to some,though IMHO important.
Self adjusting disc brakes can be a help,but they can also work against you if you aren't aware of just how worn your pads are.
I'm thinking long descents on a long tour where pads could be worn out without the rider realising how worn they are.I know someone who has degree of mechanical sympathy would be 'in touch' with the need for regular checks on pad status,but where an ever growing number cyclists treat their bike in the same way the do their car,letting a shop service a repair it,they don't always have that sympathy.
The first they realise their pads are worn is when the brakes fail or begin to make 'funny' noises,if that happens on a long descent it could be a bit hairy to say the least :shock: .

Contrast that with cable discs,or rim brakes FTM,where they need to be manually adjusted and so prompts thought and sympathy that things are wearing.
A small point but valid IMO.
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
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simonhill
Posts: 5226
Joined: 13 Jan 2007, 11:28am
Location: Essex

Re: touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Post by simonhill »

As a simple soul with mere v brakes I sit and wonder at the debate. Personally for my type of touring I do think vs are the best. As someone said earlier, as there are problems, why bother?

Nonetheless, seeing as the OP is deciding, two points which have not been mentioned:

Weight, surely a couple of v arms are a lot lighter than all the disc malarkey. OK, I know weight will be dismissed as it is a touring bike.

Cost, surely a couple of v arms are a lot cheaper than all the disc malarkey. Even a couple of new rims hardly brings the price near.

Ding, ding seconds out, back to the main bout.
reohn2
Posts: 45158
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Post by reohn2 »

The two reasons I went for discs(cable BB7's)where wet weather stopping power,which is far superior than rim brakes,and rim wear which can be diabolical in UK winter conditions.
Other than that I agree with you.
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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
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molzor
Posts: 113
Joined: 21 Dec 2014, 12:34pm

Re: touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Post by molzor »

I have decided to go for shimano's fully mechanical BR-R317 brakes.

Go on, tell me I've made the wrong choice.
pwa
Posts: 17371
Joined: 2 Oct 2011, 8:55pm

Re: touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Post by pwa »

molzor wrote:I have decided to go for shimano's fully mechanical BR-R317 brakes.

Go on, tell me I've made the wrong choice.


You do realise you will have to give us a progress report when you've put some miles into them? Hope they serve you well.
reohn2
Posts: 45158
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Post by reohn2 »

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"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
molzor
Posts: 113
Joined: 21 Dec 2014, 12:34pm

Re: touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Post by molzor »

Full details:

Shimano BR-R317 disc brake caliper
SM-MAF160PS brake adapters
Shimano SLX 160mm rotor

I will post an update and let you know how it goes!
TonyR
Posts: 5390
Joined: 31 Aug 2008, 12:51pm

Re: touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Post by TonyR »

molzor wrote:I have decided to go for shimano's fully mechanical BR-R317 brakes.

Go on, tell me I've made the wrong choice.


Not at all. You've asked the question, you've heard the responses and made an informed decision. Why should we contest it?
cc1085
Posts: 95
Joined: 8 Feb 2015, 11:41pm

Re: touring and flying with hydraulic disc brakes

Post by cc1085 »

molzor wrote:Hello,
I am currently in the process of building up a tourer using a croix de fer frame. The man in the bike shop couldnt understand why I wanted canti brakes, and they dont fit on the frame anyway. I guess i can go with cable disc brakes...But do any of you have any thoughts on using hydraulic disc breaks on a tourer.

I understand some of the pro points for using hydraulic brakes but are they really suitable for touring? and furthermore, has anyone had issues flying with them?


Never had any problems with hydraulic disc brakes, they are as, far as I'm concerned. more reliable than any other type of braking system.
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